Earth matters

[Speaker to Animals]

OK. So you don't know what lime mortar is.
Why didn't you just say that rather than blather on about plaster?

If a contractor's life depended on the structure's safety, would he build a "lime mortar" building or something safe?

It's easy to talk shit when you won't realistically end up buried in rubble because your idea is fucking stupid.

What sort of mortar do you think has held together the walls on the cathedrals and castles that have been standing around for nearly a thousand years all over Europe?

The ones that require a giant footprint for all the buttressing?

A cathedral was not just some building. They took three or four generations to build. They were enormous multi-generational great works.

[Fife]

I bet plaster construction will be coming back in Martha's Vineyard and Northern Virginia in a big fucking way.

:goteam: :drunk:

[Montegriffo]

We've had a better alternative to cement in most usages for centuries.

Lime mortar, render and plaster

Advantages over cement


• By being produced at lower temperatures than cement, lime mortar requires less energy, resulting in 20% less CO2 output.

• Lime putty absorbs CO2 in the curing process. Non-hydraulic lime absorbs nearly its own weight in CO2, hydraulic lime, around 75% and lower.

• Lime mortar can be re-cycled, unlike cement

• Bricks using lime mortar can be recycled unlike the cement bonded equivalent which can only be used for hardcore.

• Strong, flexible, permeable. Traditional buildings built using lime mortar move and absorb moisture. In comparison with cement mortar which is rigid, lime mortar 'moves' with the structure and so prevents masonry from cracking. By using lime mortar, expansion joints can be avoided. Likewise the imperviousness of cement mortar prevents it from absorbing water from the structure whereas lime mortar acts as a kind of 'wick', absorbing the moisture and allowing it to evaporate. By absorbing moisture, lime mortar is keeping the masonry dryer and lessening the risk of spalling.
2 types of lime mortar: Hydraulic and Non-Hydraulic.

Mortar and pointing in brickwork

Non-hydraulic lime mortar ('fat lime') mixed with sand in a 1:3 ratio. However, note that non-hydraulic lime takes time to set. If quick construction is required use hydraulic mortar or non-hydraulic mortar with pozzolan added to speed up carbonation ('lean lime'). Pozzolan is typically brickdust, calcinced clay etc. Adding pozzolan is known as ' gauging'.

Render

Use either hydraulic lime or non-hydraulic. Non-hydraulic lime requires an element of cement. ( Green note: the CO2 equation here involves the balancing of the CO2 produced in the cement making process against non-hydraulic limes greater CO2 absorption than hydraulic lime.) Hydraulic lime will set much faster than non-hydraulic.

Plaster

Un-gauged non-hydraulic lime mortar using well-matured lime putty and sharp and well-graded aggregate. This does not require special skills. Use non-hydraulic lime and sand in a 1:3 ratio. Coat with limewash.

The difference between hydraulic and non-hydraulic limes is that non-hydraulic mortar sets with exposure to the air as it absorbs CO2. Hydraulic lime however relies on a complex chemical reaction between the calcium hydroxide and the impurties which is initiated by contact with water

http://www.greenspec.co.uk/building-des ... ar-render/

What part of that post made you think I was talking about industrial scale replacement of cement?
It clearly refers to mortar, bricks, render and plaster.

[Ph64]

Plastig bags are made from Ethane gas that comes of at the very top of the refining tower. Mostly from refining natural gas. They get the ethane out to prevent the gas from burning to hot. They used to burn of the ethane of at the top, remember the eternal lights on top of refining towers, until some smart guy figured out how to link the molecules into chains and make a great product instead.
They can’t stop making ethane. It’s a product of the refining process.
Few things burn as cleanly as ethane (or plastic bags). It leaves only heat, water vapor and some CO2.

Wow, 3 pages added in under a day.

Yes, the stuff used for plastics is a byproduct of the refining process. One 42 (iirc) gallon standard "barrel" of oil produces some refined gasoline, some diesel (less refined), and a bunch of byproducts that are used for motor/lubrication oils (various grades) as well as plastics. You don't just "stop burning gasoline/diesel" and *still* get all those other refined products.

Ethane if course is used in polyethylene (PETE, #1 recyclable) - "soda bottle" plastic, also high density polyethylene (HDPE, #2) "milk jug" plastic, low density polyethylene (LDPE, #4) "flexible lid" plastic (lid on milk jugs, snap on lids for coffee cans, etc). #3 is polyvinyl chloride (PVC), #5 is polypropylene, and #6 is polystyrene... Pretty sure all of them come from other refining byproducts of oil.

Of course on the bright side, if the US stops burning all that gasoline/diesel, there's sure to be good money to be made selling it to China and other countries at a cheap price, while we use the plastic byproducts. Doesn't really do much to prevent all that CO2 though, just changes who is burning it.

[PartyOf5]

Look, you know you're on the naughty step. Why are you still trying to talk to me? I can't even see your posts.
Go bite someone else's ankle. Or better still, come up with some original content of your own rather than just knocking other people's.

Yet you still respond to my posts.

I'm not trying to talk to you. I already declared you hopeless, so there is no use. I just like pointing out your BS. It's a public service I'm doing.

I can tell I'm on your naughty step. You wanna know how? Because it's filled with little boys.

[brewster]

Plastig bags are made from Ethane gas that comes of at the very top of the refining tower. Mostly from refining natural gas. They get the ethane out to prevent the gas from burning to hot. They used to burn of the ethane of at the top, remember the eternal lights on top of refining towers, until some smart guy figured out how to link the molecules into chains and make a great product instead.
They can’t stop making ethane. It’s a product of the refining process.
Few things burn as cleanly as ethane (or plastic bags). It leaves only heat, water vapor and some CO2.

Wow, 3 pages added in under a day.

Yes, the stuff used for plastics is a byproduct of the refining process. One 42 (iirc) gallon standard "barrel" of oil produces some refined gasoline, some diesel (less refined), and a bunch of byproducts that are used for motor/lubrication oils (various grades) as well as plastics. You don't just "stop burning gasoline/diesel" and *still* get all those other refined products.

Ethane if course is used in polyethylene (PETE, #1 recyclable) - "soda bottle" plastic, also high density polyethylene (HDPE, #2) "milk jug" plastic, low density polyethylene (LDPE, #4) "flexible lid" plastic (lid on milk jugs, snap on lids for coffee cans, etc). #3 is polyvinyl chloride (PVC), #5 is polypropylene, and #6 is polystyrene... Pretty sure all of them come from other refining byproducts of oil.

Of course on the bright side, if the US stops burning all that gasoline/diesel, there's sure to be good money to be made selling it to China and other countries at a cheap price, while we use the plastic byproducts. Doesn't really do much to prevent all that CO2 though, just changes who is burning it.

I was under the impression that lots of the heavier molecules were "cracked" in the refining process to produce the volatile fuel molecules, so that if you were only interested in the polymer feedstocks the yields would be much higher. I do know that Polyethylene is also produced from NG.

They still flare from the towers of the refineries along the NJ Turnpike, it looks like the opening scene from Bladerunner on some nights. It's amazing they can't do something better with it, even just burn it in a generator next to the stack and feed it into the grid.

[TheReal_ND]

Look, you know you're on the naughty step. Why are you still trying to talk to me? I can't even see your posts.
Go bite someone else's ankle. Or better still, come up with some original content of your own rather than just knocking other people's.

Yet you still respond to my posts.

I'm not trying to talk to you. I already declared you hopeless, so there is no use. I just like pointing out your BS. It's a public service I'm doing.

I can tell I'm on your naughty step. You wanna know how? Because it's filled with little boys.

LOL

[Speaker to Animals]

A growing number of children are being treated for an overwhelming terror of “environmental doom” as climate alarmists spread fears of an impending climate disaster, the Daily Telegraph has reported.

“Protests by groups such as Extinction Rebellion, the recent fires in the Amazon and apocalyptic warnings by the teenage activist Greta Thunberg have prompted a ‘tsunami’ of young people seeking help,” the Telegraph’s science correspondent reported Monday.

“A lot of parents are coming into therapy asking for help with the children and it has escalated a lot this summer,” said psychotherapist Caroline Hickman of the Climate Psychology Alliance (CPA).

“The symptoms are the same [as clinical anxiety], the feelings are the same, but the cause is different,” she said. “The fear is of environmental doom — that we’re all going to die.”

https://www.breitbart.com/environment/2 ... te-change/


For those of you younger than, say, 38.. stop and imagine how that reads to those of us who grew up during the Cold War when total nuclear war loomed over all of civilization like a very real (not fake) sword of Damocles.

[PartyOf5]

I wonder how many of those parents taking their children in for trauma therapy helped cause it.

[Ph64]

A growing number of children are being treated for an overwhelming terror of “environmental doom” as climate alarmists spread fears of an impending climate disaster, the Daily Telegraph has reported.

“Protests by groups such as Extinction Rebellion, the recent fires in the Amazon and apocalyptic warnings by the teenage activist Greta Thunberg have prompted a ‘tsunami’ of young people seeking help,” the Telegraph’s science correspondent reported Monday.

“A lot of parents are coming into therapy asking for help with the children and it has escalated a lot this summer,” said psychotherapist Caroline Hickman of the Climate Psychology Alliance (CPA).

“The symptoms are the same [as clinical anxiety], the feelings are the same, but the cause is different,” she said. “The fear is of environmental doom — that we’re all going to die.”

https://www.breitbart.com/environment/2 ... te-change/


For those of you younger than, say, 38.. stop and imagine how that reads to those of us who grew up during the Cold War when total nuclear war loomed over all of civilization like a very real (not fake) sword of Damocles.

Yeah, but we had those nuke-proof wooden desks to hide under.

Difference is, I suppose, it wasn't the "certainty" that climate change is being pushed as.