neo-Nazis in British Army arrested

[DBTrek]

HOLY JEEZ . . . you probably have to be American to appreciate just how crazy this British article Monte cited is. I mean, to the Euros here this probably looks normal, perhaps even (I shudder to think) reasonable . . . but I think the US users will get that whole creepy-doublespeak vibe reading it:

Police and community groups have documented surges in Islamophobic hate crime in the wake of the Isis-linked attacks in Westminster, Manchester and London Bridge.

Greater Manchester Police’s data showed a 500 per cent increase in reported anti-Muslim hate crimes after Abedi’s bombing, with 224 reports in the following month compared with 37 during the same period in 2016.

The National Police Chiefs' Council (NPCC) said police recorded 234 hate crime incidents 48 hours after the Westminster attack, 273 following the Manchester bombing and 319 two days after the London Bridge attack.

"Guys . . . guys . . . the Islamic terrorists have just pulled off a chain of triple murder attacks at our historic sites and a longstanding city. What should we do?"

. . .

"QUICK - GET OUT THERE AND DOCUMENT THE ISLAMAPHOBIA!"



Whooooooo! Y'all crazier than a four-way stop on a two lane road.
Glad you have those priorities locked down tight.

[Montegriffo]

Can't see how that might go sideways at all.

Well he did just invoke the Irish Republican Army as his pretext, which, civil war that, hence, sounds like things have gone pretty far into the sideways zone already, but Monte is simply loathe to admit it, either to us, or in fact even to himself.

What? Is this because I didn't want martial law imposed over a couple of terrorist attacks earlier this year?
We have a fairly competant police force which turned up and terminated the perps in around 8 minutes, no trigger happy 1st Para required thanks, one bloody Sunday is enough....

[Smitty-48]

Can't see how that might go sideways at all.

Well he did just invoke the Irish Republican Army as his pretext, which, civil war that, hence, sounds like things have gone pretty far into the sideways zone already, but Monte is simply loathe to admit it, either to us, or in fact even to himself.

What? Is this because I didn't want martial law imposed over a couple of terrorist attacks earlier this year?
We have a fairly competant police force which turned up and terminated the perps in around 8 minutes, no trigger happy 1st Para required thanks, one bloody Sunday is enough....

Once you've invoked the Right Wing in England as being the new "IRA" and then asserted that as a pretext to employ the counterterrorism act against them under the rubric of incitement, you've already declared martial law, dictionary definition of therein, but as to Special Branch being less trigger happy than 16 Air Assault Brigade? I wouldn't say that, no, in fact, I'd trust the Paras more than CO19.

[Smitty-48]

Bear in mind, the Bogside Massacre wasn't a mistake, 1 Para was directed to do it, by their chain of command. It wasn't "trigger happy", they were ordered to launch that attack.

If you didn't order to them to do it, they wouldn't have done it, the army is more disciplined than the police, much tighter leash, but if you order the army to kill people, they'll do it, if you don't want them to, don't order them to.

[Montegriffo]

Well he did just invoke the Irish Republican Army as his pretext, which, civil war that, hence, sounds like things have gone pretty far into the sideways zone already, but Monte is simply loathe to admit it, either to us, or in fact even to himself.

What? Is this because I didn't want martial law imposed over a couple of terrorist attacks earlier this year?
We have a fairly competant police force which turned up and terminated the perps in around 8 minutes, no trigger happy 1st Para required thanks, one bloody Sunday is enough....

Once you've invoked the Right Wing in England as being the new "IRA" and then asserted that as a pretext to employ the counterterrorism act against them under the rubric of incitement, you've already declared martial law, dictionary definition of therein, but as to Special Branch being less trigger happy than 16 Air Assault Brigade? I wouldn't say that, no, in fact, I'd trust the Paras more than CO19.

You seem to be confusing me offering the IRA as an example of "lefties" being arrested with me suggesting right wing extremists are the new IRA. Not what I said but whatever...

[Smitty-48]

You seem to be confusing me offering the IRA as an example of "lefties" being arrested with me suggesting right wing extremists are the new IRA. Not what I said but whatever...

Whatevs, everybody reading this can see what you're saying and they can see that you are trying desperately to downplay inherent martial law as being "business as usual".

I'm not personally buying your narrative tho, seems more like the British government is in a state of panic about any dissent against the establishment order, and they are in fact asserting that to be as "the IRA!" as a blatant pretext to employ war measures in England against anybody who says the wrong thing on the internet.

I'll leave it to others to come to their own conclusions, but I for one am convinced that you're totally full of shit at this point. /shrugs

[Montegriffo]

The British govt is completely taken up with sorting out the Brexit mess right now, this was a case of someone breaking the law and getting prosecuted for it.
At ease sgt, your services are not required, thanks for your concern.

[TheReal_ND]

Let's see the exact post that got him arrested. I wonder if I can find it.

[Smitty-48]

The British govt is completely taken up with sorting out the Brexit mess right now, this was a case of someone breaking the law and getting prosecuted for it.
At ease sgt, your services are not required, thanks for your concern.

Again, whatevs, but I for one think that the Americans have you sussed exactly, the counterterrorism act being employed, war measures, but not against the Islamic terrorists, against the English for saying the wrong thing on the internet, any dissent from the liberal orthodoxy, now a military imperative which supercedes actual security threats.

[BjornP]

HOLY JEEZ . . . you probably have to be American to appreciate just how crazy this British article Monte cited is. I mean, to the Euros here this probably looks normal, perhaps even (I shudder to think) reasonable . . . but I think the US users will get that whole creepy-doublespeak vibe reading it:

Police and community groups have documented surges in Islamophobic hate crime in the wake of the Isis-linked attacks in Westminster, Manchester and London Bridge.

Greater Manchester Police’s data showed a 500 per cent increase in reported anti-Muslim hate crimes after Abedi’s bombing, with 224 reports in the following month compared with 37 during the same period in 2016.

The National Police Chiefs' Council (NPCC) said police recorded 234 hate crime incidents 48 hours after the Westminster attack, 273 following the Manchester bombing and 319 two days after the London Bridge attack.

"Guys . . . guys . . . the Islamic terrorists have just pulled off a chain of triple murder attacks at our historic sites and a longstanding city. What should we do?"

. . .

"QUICK - GET OUT THERE AND DOCUMENT THE ISLAMAPHOBIA!"



Whooooooo! Y'all crazier than a four-way stop on a two lane road.
Glad you have those priorities locked down tight.

What you suggest is indeed neither reasonable nor normal to any Europeans. However, your interpretation of that quote and what it actually says is also not reasonable. I don't know what the opposite of Occam's Razor is called, but you're pretty much making a conclusion out of a whole lot of assumptions.

It is more likely that police make a note of which crimes are hate crimes, and possibly that some research group picked up on a surge in "Islamophobic" hate crimes from their stats. To document which sorts of crimes are on the rise in any given society seems the smart thing to do, no matter which crimes we're talking about. I hear even Americans do this. 500% increase is, you know, sort of a lot and enough to both make it document-worthy, so to speak, and also enough to make it newsworthy. So is terrorism, but you know, one does not actually have to choose between documenting the two. And indeed, the British don't.

But what with 99% likelihood didn't happen was that some official frantically ordered a survey on hate crimes against Muslims simply to overshadow Islamic terrorism. Especially since that's documented already. Rise in crime are documented by law enforcement. Looking at crime stats and noticing a rise in hate crimes against specific groups....? Why shouldn't that be documented?

What the media decide to cover, is logically not going to be representative of the total body of work UK police undertake...or document. A journalist could sift through this:

https://data.police.uk/

..and his editor may tell him to only focus on hate crimes against Muslims because... *reasons that make sense to British progressives who want to show how much they care about signalling their virtues*.

Tl;dr: That media report that hate crimes against Muslims have risen in the UK, doesn't mean that some government body ONLY documented that, or went out of their way to document it. There is documentation about British terrorism here:

https://www.gov.uk/government/collectio ... statistics