Common Sense 322 - Betting on Long Shots

[Smitty-48]

I would argue there is a greater Slavic Empire just sitting there unrecognized by the world.
The future is Slavic

the relevant analysis to us now is that the Chinese and Russians are actually enemies not allies

the Russians took most of that land from China

China wants it back

the Chinese are not using military force however

they are using financial & economic power, and Chinese immigrants flowing into Siberia

The Chinese have never been able to export military power. I don't see that changing.

actually there was a period where they were projecting power

they had a huge navy and they were sailing it all over the world, they used to sail it to Europe

what happened was they abandoned sea power and became the Middle Kingdom

since there is no such thing as a land empire, they were quickly surpassed by European sea power

now they are back to building a navy to challenge the dominant sea power over Freedom of Navigation

[C-Mag]

No one has ever claimed the Mongols built an Empire.
The claim has always been they controlled the largest land empire.
Beating the strawman of "built" a thousand more times serves no purpose, other than fluffing more chaff into the air.

It lasted for 150 years, and portions of it like the Golden Horde for 300 years. That's not bad in terms of empire.

But we have no connection to that time and place, so we don't remember them. Who ever hears about how great an empire was in what is now Uzbekistan, no one.

They built cities, and irrigation systems and their ruins are still there, but no one is visiting them like the Parthenon.

[SuburbanFarmer]

Just being able to hold the entire continent of Asia, under a common law, practically end crime completely for decades…. It’s pretty stunning.

[Smitty-48]

there's no such thing as a land empire, empires are by the sea

The definition of empire disagrees.
I take your point

whatever, bro

I'm not trying to prove anything, it's not an argument, just a conversation

you can take it or leave it, no biggie

if you like Dan Carlin theatre of the mind type stuff, it's no skin off my teeth

[C-Mag]

actually there was a period where they were projecting power

they had a huge navy and they were sailing it all over the world, they used to sail it to Europe

what happened was they abandoned sea power and became the Middle Kingdom

since there is no such thing as a land empire, they were quickly surpassed by European sea power

now they are back to building a navy to challenge the dominant sea power over Freedom of Navigation

Yeah, I can't remember that admirals name, his claims are pretty fantastic. Like claiming to circumnavigate the globe, discover America a hundred years before Columbus, etc.

He was a Eunich who hitched a ride with a guy that became emperor, it is proven they had a huge fleet, and even brought a girraffe back from Somalia (the Romans did this 1400 years before). My understanding is modern thought is he made it to Africa, maybe down to Madagascar, but that's about it. They are even skeptical he made it to Australia.

But that certainly wasn't exporting power. Heck, they never defeated Japan, Korea or Vietnam which are all close neighbors.

[DBTrek]

It is skin off your teeth, when you claim to be a paragon of good faith arguments, yet build them on faithless tactics like redefining words.
And if not off your teeth, off your good name.
/shrug

[Smitty-48]

Heck, they never defeated Japan, Korea or Vietnam which are all close neighbors.

but that wouldn't have mattered, because taking close neighbours wouldn't amount to an empire

the actual competitors who dominated were all sea powers, the Spanish, the Portuguese and the Dutch

then the French & British beat the Spanish, Portuguese and Dutch at their own games

[C-Mag]

Just being able to hold the entire continent of Asia, under a common law, practically end crime completely for decades…. It’s pretty stunning.

The Russians have been the dominant power in all of Asia since Peter the Great, 300 years, not a small feat.

[DBTrek]

Finding powers the Mongols did not defeat doesn't really detract from the extraordinary number they did defeat.
It's true Genghis Khan never beat the Apache.
But he never met the Apache either.

His empire was fighting Hungarian Knights and Japanese Samurai at the same time - in an era when those two cultures had not even met.
Not bad.

But yeah, he never put Aztecs to the sword.

[Smitty-48]

off your good name.
/shrug

I'm a bad guy because I define empire by the Roman : Imperium ?

that seems a little harsh

but whatever