Reopening America and the Cathedral's Counter-Boogaloo

[Xenophon]

To date: we have evidence suggesting that recovery may confer no immunity. There is nothing to suggest that a vaccine would even work since no human coronaviruses already in circulation are amenable to vaccination. We have no idea how many people have had this or what exactly is going on out there because our federal government has done everything possible to block testing outside of their narrow control. We have no proven treatments to ameliorate the symptoms and put a stop to the dying and permanent damage this disease causes. Amongst the "mild" cases, many people have permanent organ damage -- lungs, hearts, kidneys, livers and even some neurological damage in their brains.

I think in the grand scheme of "concerns" figuring out how banks and shitty landlords get paid ranks pretty damned low. We can figure that out. We need to get a handle on the pandemic before we go back to our golden calf worship.

Cool. Now how would you deal with people out of work and unable to pay for the essentials they need to stay home?

We can figure that out.

The rest of your post is just ad hominem. It's as I said before. The people hysterically screaming about staying inside no matter what are the ones who can afford to stay inside indefinitely due to their profession. You can sit comfortably in your appalachia-shack and swirl brandy while laughing at the peasants who aren't able to do what you have done.

[Speaker to Animals]

Cool. Now how would you deal with people out of work and unable to pay for the essentials they need to stay home?

We can figure that out.

The rest of your post is just ad hominem. It's as I said before. The people hysterically screaming about staying inside no matter what are the ones who have nothing to lose except their own lives. You can sit comfortably in your appalachia-shack and swirl brandy while laughing at the peasants who aren't able to do what you have done.

It's not ad hominem. I didn't attack your argument by attacking you. I correctly pointed out that you are like King Knut ordering the pandemic to go away.

NOTHING CHANGED since this began. We still have at least 90% of the population completely vulnerable to this disease. We don't even know for sure that we can achieve herd immunity because people keep retesting positive and we don't know if it is because the virus hides only to reemerge or the antibodies do fuck all to prevent future infection.

What the fuck do you want us to do? Just go back to normal and carry on until civilization collapses? There are pressing concerns that have to be addressed right now, and these childlike tantrums to go back in time to how it was before the pandemic don't help anybody, including you.

I need you to grab your shoulders and shake some reality into your thick skull. We. Are. Fucked. We have to deal with what has happened; not helplessly wail about not being able to go back to the way it was before. I can't believe there are still people in the denial stage of grief. Amazing.

[Xenophon]

We can figure that out.

The rest of your post is just ad hominem. It's as I said before. The people hysterically screaming about staying inside no matter what are the ones who have nothing to lose except their own lives. You can sit comfortably in your appalachia-shack and swirl brandy while laughing at the peasants who aren't able to do what you have done.

It's not ad hominem. I didn't attack your argument by attacking you. I correctly pointed out that you are like King Knut ordering the pandemic to go away.

NOTHING CHANGED since this began. We still have at least 90% of the population completely vulnerable to this disease. We don't even know for sure that we can achieve herd immunity because people keep retesting positive and we don't know if it is because the virus hides only to reemerge or the antibodies do fuck all to prevent future infection.

What the fuck do you want us to do? Just go back to normal and carry on until civilization collapses? There are pressing concerns that have to be addressed right now, and these childlike tantrums to go back in time to how it was before the pandemic don't help anybody, including you.

I'm not sure I'm the one throwing a tantrum. I'm not demanding things go back to normal. What I am saying is that there are families who are effected by this pandemic, and they can't just stay at home forever until a vaccine comes down from on high.

Are you thinking that it won't matter if they can't pay their mortgages or rent because society will collapse and it will be irrelevant? That's not an entirely unreasonable opinion.

[Speaker to Animals]

I mean.. you really do have this vision in your mind that somehow this is just going to magically go away, don't you. You think it is going to hit us, recede, and then we go back to business as usual?

[Speaker to Animals]

The rest of your post is just ad hominem. It's as I said before. The people hysterically screaming about staying inside no matter what are the ones who have nothing to lose except their own lives. You can sit comfortably in your appalachia-shack and swirl brandy while laughing at the peasants who aren't able to do what you have done.

It's not ad hominem. I didn't attack your argument by attacking you. I correctly pointed out that you are like King Knut ordering the pandemic to go away.

NOTHING CHANGED since this began. We still have at least 90% of the population completely vulnerable to this disease. We don't even know for sure that we can achieve herd immunity because people keep retesting positive and we don't know if it is because the virus hides only to reemerge or the antibodies do fuck all to prevent future infection.

What the fuck do you want us to do? Just go back to normal and carry on until civilization collapses? There are pressing concerns that have to be addressed right now, and these childlike tantrums to go back in time to how it was before the pandemic don't help anybody, including you.

I'm not sure I'm the one throwing a tantrum. I'm not demanding things go back to normal. What I am saying is that there are families who are effected by this pandemic, and they can't just stay at home forever until a vaccine comes down from on high.

Are you thinking that it won't matter if they can't pay their mortgages or rent because society will collapse and it will be irrelevant?

Oh, I am sure of it.

"WE NEED TO GO BACK TO WORK LIKE IT WAS BEFORE!!!"

It's not going back to the way it was before. News flash.

[Xenophon]

I mean.. you really do have this vision in your mind that somehow this is just going to magically go away, don't you. You think it is going to hit us, recede, and then we go back to business as usual?

No. I'm not sure I've ever said that. I'm asking a very specific question that you're dodging by implying that I'm one of the "just a flu, bro" types.

[Xenophon]

It's not ad hominem. I didn't attack your argument by attacking you. I correctly pointed out that you are like King Knut ordering the pandemic to go away.

NOTHING CHANGED since this began. We still have at least 90% of the population completely vulnerable to this disease. We don't even know for sure that we can achieve herd immunity because people keep retesting positive and we don't know if it is because the virus hides only to reemerge or the antibodies do fuck all to prevent future infection.

What the fuck do you want us to do? Just go back to normal and carry on until civilization collapses? There are pressing concerns that have to be addressed right now, and these childlike tantrums to go back in time to how it was before the pandemic don't help anybody, including you.

I'm not sure I'm the one throwing a tantrum. I'm not demanding things go back to normal. What I am saying is that there are families who are effected by this pandemic, and they can't just stay at home forever until a vaccine comes down from on high.

Are you thinking that it won't matter if they can't pay their mortgages or rent because society will collapse and it will be irrelevant?

Oh, I am sure of it.

"WE NEED TO GO BACK TO WORK LIKE IT WAS BEFORE!!!"

It's not going back to the way it was before. News flash.

So you're positive society will collapse completely, and mortgages and rents won't matter because we won't have the social structure to enforce debt agreements?

[Speaker to Animals]

I mean.. you really do have this vision in your mind that somehow this is just going to magically go away, don't you. You think it is going to hit us, recede, and then we go back to business as usual?

No. I'm not sure I've ever said that. I'm asking a very specific question that you're dodging by implying that I'm one of the "just a flu, bro" types.

Okay. Stop.

Explain what exactly it is you are demanding here. Because all I am seeing are a group of total asshats demanding the pandemic go away so they can "get back to work" in the most retarded astroturf movement I ever saw in my life (and probably ever, honestly).

You say landlords and banks need to be paid. What do you want here? People just go back to work in business as usual to pay debts? Because that's just going to get a lot of people killed and you are going to end up with a worse economy than had we tried something even ten percent more intelligent.

To add to that, please answer this question: what in the holy fuck do you think changed that warrants us to "go back to work"?? We still have not seen a significant percentage of the population infected. We don't even know if we get immunity from recovery. We don't have drug treatments to stop the death and permanent disability.

If we go back to work and you get two million fatalities with probably at least ten times that number on permanent disability, what exactly do you think is going to happen to our economy? Had you considered that when you opined about the plight of landlords and banks?

[Xenophon]

I mean.. you really do have this vision in your mind that somehow this is just going to magically go away, don't you. You think it is going to hit us, recede, and then we go back to business as usual?

No. I'm not sure I've ever said that. I'm asking a very specific question that you're dodging by implying that I'm one of the "just a flu, bro" types.

Okay. Stop.

Explain what exactly it is you are demanding here. Because all I am seeing are a group of total asshats demanding the pandemic go away so they can "get back to work" in the most retarded astroturf movement I ever saw in my life (and probably ever, honestly).

You say landlords and banks need to be paid. What do you want here? People just go back to work in business as usual to pay debts? Because that's just going to get a lot of people killed and you are going to end up with a worse economy than had we tried something even ten percent more intelligent.

To add to that, please answer this question: what in the holy fuck do you think changed that warrants us to "go back to work"?? We still have not seen a significant percentage of the population infected. We don't even know if we get immunity from recovery. We don't have drug treatments to stop the death and permanent disability.

If we go back to work and you get two million fatalities with probably at least ten times that number on permanent disability, what exactly do you think is going to happen to our economy? Had you considered that when you opined about the plight of landlords and banks?

What I'm saying is that not paying rent and mortgage will still get people kicked out of their homes no matter how badly you want them to stay home and not work. I do not care about banks getting paid and landlords getting paid. What will happen to those people who are out of work because of the pandemic will be that they are forcibly removed from their homes. What is your grand plan to stop that from happening? The social structures are still in place as of right now to enforce the payment of debts. Families will be on the receiving end of eviction. What is your plan to protect the people who can't pay their mortgages and rent because the pandemic has them out of a job?

Right now your plan appears to be, "Screw 'em."

I get it. We don't know much about the virus and how it operates, and opening the economy back up will probably exacerbate the pandemic, undoing any "flattening the curve" that happened. But that still doesn't answer the question of, "If people are laid off due to the pandemic and aren't able to pay their mortgages and rents, what happens if they can't pay their mortgage, rent, and utilities?" Every time I ask that question, you reply with hysterical screeching and misrepresentation of the question I am asking you.

[Speaker to Animals]

No. I'm not sure I've ever said that. I'm asking a very specific question that you're dodging by implying that I'm one of the "just a flu, bro" types.

Okay. Stop.

Explain what exactly it is you are demanding here. Because all I am seeing are a group of total asshats demanding the pandemic go away so they can "get back to work" in the most retarded astroturf movement I ever saw in my life (and probably ever, honestly).

You say landlords and banks need to be paid. What do you want here? People just go back to work in business as usual to pay debts? Because that's just going to get a lot of people killed and you are going to end up with a worse economy than had we tried something even ten percent more intelligent.

To add to that, please answer this question: what in the holy fuck do you think changed that warrants us to "go back to work"?? We still have not seen a significant percentage of the population infected. We don't even know if we get immunity from recovery. We don't have drug treatments to stop the death and permanent disability.

If we go back to work and you get two million fatalities with probably at least ten times that number on permanent disability, what exactly do you think is going to happen to our economy? Had you considered that when you opined about the plight of landlords and banks?

What I'm saying is that not paying rent and mortgage will still get people kicked out of their homes no matter how badly you want them to stay home and not work. I do not care about banks getting paid and landlords getting paid. What will happen to those people who are out of work because of the pandemic will be that they are forcibly removed from their homes. What is your grand plan to stop that from happening? The social structures are still in place as of right now to enforce the payment of debts. Families will be on the receiving end of eviction. What is your plan to protect the people who can't pay their mortgages and rent because the pandemic has them out of a job?

Right now your plan appears to be, "Screw 'em."

I get it. We don't know much about the virus and how it operates, and opening the economy back up will probably exacerbate the pandemic, undoing any "flattening the curve" that happened. But that still doesn't answer the question of, "If people are laid off due to the pandemic and aren't able to pay their mortgages and rents, what happens if they can't pay their mortgage, rent, and utilities?" Every time I ask that question, you reply with hysterical screeching and misrepresentation of the question I am asking you.

You are talking as if we can't end evictions and put a halt to mortgage and rent payments until we sort this out. Are you serious right now? You are still operating in a 2019 paradigm. News flash: the world just got fucked in the ass by the worst pandemic since the middle ages.

We can put a moratorium on rent and mortgages. Bankers and landlords are not going to die. This is hardly an argument for sending millions to their deaths.

We don't even know what the fuck is going on with this disease. Look at what is happening in NYC:




There are so many things we need to figure out before we start discussing how to get the economy back to even a semblance of normal.