Global overpopulation

[brewster]

You ignore my post about new wind turbines being cheaper than feeding gas to existing gas generation plants, just like a "Host" robot on Westworld saying "that doesn't look like anything to me". Don't let anything mess with your worldview, man!

I don't think you understood. Wind turbines are great, and they're "cheap" in one sense, but less valuable in another. It's all got to do with energy storage.

And now you're ignoring all the facts about mechanical storage like the Hoover Dam proposal. It's real and has been done for decades, as I said. All you need is two reservoirs of different elevation. there's plenty of places where you could build an upper reservoir that wouldn't fill naturally from watershed and pump from a watershed filled reservoir.

[Otern]

And now you're ignoring all the facts about mechanical storage like the Hoover Dam proposal. It's real and has been done for decades, as I said. All you need is two reservoirs of different elevation. there's plenty of places where you could build an upper reservoir that wouldn't fill naturally from watershed and pump from a watershed filled reservoir.

Again, I haven't ignored that. Pump hydropower is common around here, and necessary. But it's simply not enough to replace our current demand of energy. There aren't that many unexploited hydropower locations left in the world to replace all of out energy demand.

Maybe we can manage by ramping up nuclear power, for another fifty years. But eventually, even that won't be enough.

[Speaker to Animals]

Basically, we need quite a lot of nuclear power plants and a pretty huge investment into electric-based transportation.

Cities are not sustainable.

[Otern]

Basically, we need quite a lot of nuclear power plants and a pretty huge investment into electric-based transportation.

Cities are not sustainable.

Nuclear power, yes. Electric based transportation will be the norm eventually anyway.

Problem with ramping up electric based transportation now, is that they're charged by coal and gas anyway. I think there's way too much focus on electric cars now, compared to the focus on transitioning the grid from fossil fuels. Doesn't matter if your car is electric, if that electricity is primarily generated through coal.

[brewster]

There aren't that many unexploited hydropower locations left in the world to replace all of out energy demand.

This is a non sequitur. hydropower and pump storage are two completely different things. Hydropower requires a high flowing watershed plus gradient. Pump storage only requires a relatively static supply of water and two reservoirs at different elevations. We have reservoirs everywhere. All you need to do is dam a higher valley somewhere nearby for the upper reservoir and pump the water up to it.

[brewster]

Basically, we need quite a lot of nuclear power plants and a pretty huge investment into electric-based transportation.

Cities are not sustainable.

Nuclear power, yes. Electric based transportation will be the norm eventually anyway.

Problem with ramping up electric based transportation now, is that they're charged by coal and gas anyway. I think there's way too much focus on electric cars now, compared to the focus on transitioning the grid from fossil fuels. Doesn't matter if your car is electric, if that electricity is primarily generated through coal.

All of this isn't really about technology at this point, it's about the relative costs of alternative electric power and fossil fuels. With cheap enough electric power you can do all sorts of things like rectify liquid transport fuels from hydrogen in water and carbon in the air. With expensive enough fossil fuels all sorts of biofuels become economical. This is why a big (revenue nuetral) carbon tax would be a game-changer for alternative energy development. It's hard to compete with a one-time gift from mother Earth!

[Zlaxer]

Well fuck

Congrats on actually conceding to facts, most guys here simply go into endless denial/fake news mode. Like I said, the issue is efficiency of mechanical systems, but that just economics not feasibility. At some point less efficiently stored cheap power is cheaper than fossil generated.

I saw something not long ago about a plan to use a massive carbon fiber flywheel running up to 15k rpm on a maglev bearing in vacuum for storage. Who knows? We're a fucking clever species when we're not being stupid and shortsighted.

Look at the wiki page on Methanol Economy for a mind blown on options. You can use the excess electricity to rectify carbon out of the air and make liquid auto and aircraft fuels.

I’m actually disappointed in myself for not thinking of using water as the storage medium - my guess is it’s not dense enough for home use, but certainly seems like it would work on larger scales.


Flywheels prob not feasible - they work great in space bc the vacuum is free.

[Zlaxer]

Indians and Chinese are teachable- need to get Indians out of poverty and lower population - Chinese need to get rid of PRC. Africa has way way more issues.

[Speaker to Animals]

Using kinetic energy for storage? Doesn't seem like a great idea to me, unless I am misunderstanding what is proposed here. Kinetic energy requires equilibrium with a massive crash when that equilibrium is broken (i.e. I can transfer mechanical energy to a piano dangling from a rope, but if the equilibrium of that rope holding a piano breaks.. the piano is going to make quite a crash).

[brewster]

Well fuck

Congrats on actually conceding to facts, most guys here simply go into endless denial/fake news mode. Like I said, the issue is efficiency of mechanical systems, but that just economics not feasibility. At some point less efficiently stored cheap power is cheaper than fossil generated.

I saw something not long ago about a plan to use a massive carbon fiber flywheel running up to 15k rpm on a maglev bearing in vacuum for storage. Who knows? We're a fucking clever species when we're not being stupid and shortsighted.

Look at the wiki page on Methanol Economy for a mind blown on options. You can use the excess electricity to rectify carbon out of the air and make liquid auto and aircraft fuels.

I’m actually disappointed in myself for not thinking of using water as the storage medium - my guess is it’s not dense enough for home use, but certainly seems like it would work on larger scales.


Flywheels prob not feasible - they work great in space bc the vacuum is free.

I was contemplating why not use the power to haul a big float down into the ocean? If you ever tried to push a ball down in a pool you know there's tremendous energy there. I concluded making an anchor in the seabed strong enough would be the problem.

Indians and Chinese are teachable- need to get Indians out of poverty and lower population - Chinese need to get rid of PRC. Africa has way way more issues.

Half the problems on this globe are people conflating class, wealth and culture issues with race. The Chinese became wealthy too fucking fast and have not recognized that natural resources are finite, or shed their medieval bullshit like "traditional medicine" of tiger dick, rhino horn and bear gall. They need to wake the fuck up to the damage they're doing globally. Eating pangolins FFS!