Urban vs. Rural; What's to be done?

[C-Mag]

They have 98.7% of the world doing what they want, but that's not enough.

Sounds a little Totalitarian

[brewster]

If self-government is a human right, then so is the right to bear arms..

In your opinion. I'd say even the 1st proposition needs to be qualified in many ways, otherwise it is an Anarchist position. Put absolutely, it means the block you live on has the right to declare it's sovereignty and enforce it with weapons. There's not a nation on earth that isn't a coalition of potentially divided fragments, but historically tiny self governing populations were easy pickings for aggressive neighbors, and needed to either band together or they would be absorbed by an aggressor. Civilization and society is a process of giving up some freedoms for other benefits.

Most people think Ben Franklin was opposing this idea when he said “Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety”. Turns out the Liberty he was speaking of was the PA Legislature's liberty to tax the aristocratic Penn family. Most of you do not equate taxation with Liberty at all!

https://www.lawfareblog.com/what-ben-fr ... eally-said

[PartyOf5]

American exceptionalism at it's finest. "98.7% of the world must be brainwashed if they don't agree with me!"

The US is a better place to live than 98.7% of the world, so who's doing things wrong?

[BjornP]

In most countries of the world self-defense or the defense of other persons in immidiate personal danger is considered a right. And no, brewster I don’t think "most" other countries would "consider the absence of weapons a right", either.

[Speaker to Animals]

If self-government is a human right, then so is the right to bear arms..

In your opinion. I'd say even the 1st proposition needs to be qualified in many ways, otherwise it is an Anarchist position. Put absolutely, it means the block you live on has the right to declare it's sovereignty and enforce it with weapons. There's not a nation on earth that isn't a coalition of potentially divided fragments, but historically tiny self governing populations were easy pickings for aggressive neighbors, and needed to either band together or they would be absorbed by an aggressor. Civilization and society is a process of giving up some freedoms for other benefits.

Most people think Ben Franklin was opposing this idea when he said “Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety”. Turns out the Liberty he was speaking of was the PA Legislature's liberty to tax the aristocratic Penn family. Most of you do not equate taxation with Liberty at all!

https://www.lawfareblog.com/what-ben-fr ... eally-said

You are overthinking a simple concept. A self-governed people is necessarily an armed people. Full stop. Self-evident truth.

[brewster]

American exceptionalism at it's finest. "98.7% of the world must be brainwashed if they don't agree with me!"

The US is a better place to live than 98.7% of the world, so who's doing things wrong?

American Jingoism at it's finest! There's many places I'd rather live elsewhere than certain parts of this nation. I'll bet half the rustbelt and Appalachia would happily trade for the social contract and safety net of northern Europe. WV is already well on it's way to being utterly dependent on federal entitlement monies to drive its economy anyway.

[brewster]

You are overthinking a simple concept. A self-governed people is necessarily an armed people. Full stop. Self-evident truth.

Despite plenty of evidence to the contrary? From Australia to Costa Rica to Sweden there are democracies that are not full of civilians armed to the teeth. In fact most are not, Switzerland and Israel are outliers.

[Speaker to Animals]

You are overthinking a simple concept. A self-governed people is necessarily an armed people. Full stop. Self-evident truth.

Despite plenty of evidence to the contrary? From Australia to Costa Rica to Sweden there are democracies that are not full of civilians armed to the teeth. In fact most are not, Switzerland and Israel are outliers.

Not self-government at all. A disarmed people gets the government that is imposed upon them.

[Ex-California]

American exceptionalism at it's finest. "98.7% of the world must be brainwashed if they don't agree with me!"

The US is a better place to live than 98.7% of the world, so who's doing things wrong?

American Jingoism at it's finest! There's many places I'd rather live elsewhere than certain parts of this nation. I'll bet half the rustbelt and Appalachia would happily trade for the social contract and safety net of northern Europe. WV is already well on it's way to being utterly dependent on federal entitlement monies to drive its economy anyway.

And the Northern European nations you're talking about are small enough to be counted as that 1.3%

Even the worst parts of the US are better than most of the shitholes around the world.

[brewster]

Even the worst parts of the US are better than most of the shitholes around the world.

That's quite a different statement than "The US is a better place to live than 98.7% of the world". That there are shitholes out there is undeniable, there's also quite lovely and desirable places. It's an American delusion that we cannot be compared to anywhere on earth.