Kierkegaard and Nietzsche

[GloryofGreece]

This thread I thought could be about existentialism and maybe concentrating on Kierkegaard and Nietzsche. I do love me Soren over that dreary fellow with the handlebar stash. Nietzsche seems to lack humility and seems more defeatist really.

“The function of prayer is not to influence God, but rather to change the nature of the one who prays.”
― Soren Kierkegaard

“Face the facts of being what you are, for that is what changes what you are.”
― Søren Kierkegaard

“God creates out of nothing. Wonderful you say. Yes, to be sure, but he does what is still more wonderful: he makes saints out of sinners.”


https://www.goodreads.com/author/quotes ... ierkegaard

[Martin Hash]

Nietzsche's theory of "slave morality" is the most inciteful thing I'd read at the time, perhaps goading me to similar unconventional examination of life's motives, and his explanation of why "God is dead" explained my Mormon youth to me. His later brain-cancer infused writing was too incomprehensible to me at the time, and I've never picked him up again.

[GloryofGreece]

Nietzsche's theory of "slave morality" is the most inciteful thing I'd read at the time, perhaps goading me to similar unconventional examination of life's motives, and his explanation of why "God is dead" explained my Mormon youth to me. His later brain-cancer infused writing was too incomprehensible to me at the time, and I've never picked him up again.

The idea of slave morality is basically hogwash imo. To act as if there are no masters that act with sympathy is bullshit. Of course some alphas do. Not all warriors only valued pride over piety or power over competence or over duty or honor etc. Nietzsche was was a pseudo post modernist. No thank you. God is dead b/c people are hubristic and stopped valuing memory and prudence.

[Speaker to Animals]

It's bullshit because it is opposite the reality.

Warriors tend to grow in compassion and sympathy, seeing the cruelties of war firsthand and knowing what it means to suffer.

It's the peasants and bourgeoisie that tend to lack compassion.

The most horrific shit happens when the non-warriors revolt and actually gain power.

Look at how Obama bragged about how good he is at "killing people". The man hasn't a clue what it is like. He sends other people to do what he does not comprehend.

[Speaker to Animals]

And if you don't believe it, go back and study the Cult of Mithras as one example of the warrior cults of pre-Christian antiquity. It's very similar morals to Christianity.

Christianity in some ways was the slaves adopting the ethics and morals of the elite warriors. There is much more to it, but just think about it. It does not stand up to history.

[GloryofGreece]

JP gets it right when he says the meek will inheret the earth.meaning the strong that can use their sword but choose not to. Nietzche is mostly wrong when dealing with the dilemma of creating your own values. You cannot. He thought some could.

[Speaker to Animals]

He was just wrong. His rhetoric was so good that he is quite convincing unless you step back and just consider the proposition for a bit against the actual historical record. It's actually the opposite of what he states. What he calls "slave morality" is the warrior morality. If you want to see what happens when we define our own values, then look no further than things like the Munster rebellion. The non-warriors are the ones who tend to lack sympathy.

Who do you think is more likely to show enemies mercy: General Mattis or some purple haired feminist you find on campus? Seriously think about that.

[Martin Hash]

I don't know what you guys are talking about, but Slave Morality is the attitude of slaves to be against everything their masters represent. If their masters value merit, pride, honor & autonomy, then slaves take the opposite; equality over meritocracy, humility over pride, submission over honor, and group over individual.

[Martin Hash]

Also, "God is dead," means that no longer is "God's will," an acceptable excuse. You have Free Will, life is NOT preordained.

[Speaker to Animals]

That's not really what he was talking about in Geneology of Morals or Beyond Good and Evil.

He viewed Christianity itself as fundamentally a slave morality because of it's defense of the weak and disadvantaged.

The problem with his premise, on a historical level, is that it was totally wrong. Warriors traditionally develop compassion for the weak and show mercy to the vanquished. Christianity was very much a warrior ethos. His characterization of it was ass-backwards.

It's typically the non-warriors who want to abolish values and morals. Like every fucking time. When they take over something, shit gets ugly fast.

The interesting outcome of Christianity was that it brought what used to be only a warrior ethos (think Cult of Mithras) to the mainstream. I mean, hell, Christianity was largely spread across the empire by soldiers in the very beginning. My own patron saint was a Roman general who refused to abandon his faith when Diocletian decided to kill off the Christians.