Hindus

[Speaker to Animals]

It *is* a direct consequence.

[DBTrek]

It *is* a direct consequence.

Can’t be, since there are many atheists who are not communist. You’ve put the cart before the horse.

[Speaker to Animals]

It *is* a direct consequence.

Can’t be, since there are many atheists who are not communist. You’ve put the cart before the horse.

Why does every atheist have to be a communist for communism to be a consequence of atheism?

Marx and Engels were the next iteration in the philosophical tradition of men like Hume. You cannot philosophically arrive at something like that without first adopting the philosophical groundwork of atheism.

I do not mean that the average dipshit who calls himself an atheist is responsible. I mean that communism is a branch of atheist philosophy.

Similarly, you cannot get to philosophy like that of Teilhard de Chardin without a Christian tradition behind it. He built off of St. Thomas, who built off of St. Augustine. Those two built off Plato and Aristotle.

The truth is that it is philosophy that is the most dangerous endeavor. Always has been.

[DBTrek]

Communism eschews religion because it doesn’t want the state to have competitors. Atheists don’t believe in a god or gods for many reasons, but no individual atheist is “the state”, so their atheism is completely divorced from political movements. That’s why I don’t consider communism a direct consequence of atheism.

You don’t need divinity to come up with communism, you need capitalism, mercantilism, and other economic philosophies for communism to compete against. Religion is just a side issue for communists, not a driving force behind the philosophy. Communists dictators have a long history of liquidating anyone who threatens their power, religion is just one of many potential threats.

I’d buy the inverse - that atheism is a direct consequence of communism.

[Speaker to Animals]

Idealism.
Phenomenalism


No communism without first adopting those two things, and that's essentially atheism, or the philosophical basis of it.

You confuse two different propositions.

I said: Communism is a direct consequence of atheism.

You argued as if I said: Communism is s direct consequence of atheists.

I am not talking about people but philosophy.

edit:

should have used phenomenalism instead of materialism.

A third big leg to communism is Hegalian dialectics, which is what led to dialectical materialism, which is the very basis of Marxism.

[SuburbanFarmer]

This is why people call you names. You say stupid shit, and when someone calmly explains the errors in your reasoning, you crank up the stupidty.

I’m disputing that connection. Communism is not a direct consequence of atheism. (Did I say communism was a direct consequence of atheism or are you being fucking stupid?)

Yes, actually, you did. One post ago.

Of course disease killed millions, but that does not discount the mass slaughter and enslavement by the Spanish in their colonial adventures. (Colonialism isn’t a synonym for religion. Are you aware of that, or are you fucking stupid?)

Another incredible straw man. I’m starting to think that you simply don’t bother reading anything I type, and look for insult humor.

Again, deflection. (No, I directly corrected your erroneous assertions and you responded by saying fucking stupid things)


Hopefully you begin to see why people’s patience with you is pretty well shot.
/shrug

The feeling is quickly becoming mutual.

[DBTrek]

Never said communism was a direct consequence of atheism.

So your reply amounts to a lie, a complaint, and a complaint.

Why don’t people engage in more conversation with you again?

[BjornP]

Yes. History shows that as soon as a nation embraces atheism, the murders and genocides magically stop. Oh wait..

False correlation. But I would wager that mass homicides and religious wars decline.

Yes, without religions religious wars would probably decline. *ahem*

As for the most common forms of war (inheritence wars, economically motivated conflict), and as for mass murder, they would of course not decline. Try actually googling historical mass murders/genocides and wars by civilian deaths. Don't just go on your feels.

[SuburbanFarmer]

Yes. History shows that as soon as a nation embraces atheism, the murders and genocides magically stop. Oh wait..

False correlation. But I would wager that mass homicides and religious wars decline.

Yes, without religions religious wars would probably decline. *ahem*

As for the most common forms of war (inheritence wars, economically motivated conflict), and as for mass murder, they would of course not decline. Try actually googling historical mass murders/genocides and wars by civilian deaths. Don't just go on your feels.

It was said with humor. ‘Mass homicides’ was a lazy term. I should have said ‘persecutions’.

I don’t operate on feelz, but my feelz are getting pretty tired of this.

[SuburbanFarmer]

Disease killed people in the new world, not religion, GCF.

And yes, declaring an atheist state, persecuting religion, and killing millions directly or through state policy comes back to both atheism and communism.

This is where you drew a line from “people not being religious” to Communism.