A Discussion: Needle Exchanges

[Kath]

You defer to an isolated 6% HIV metric for yours.
You are both more alike than you are different - neither of you willing to look beyond the narrow scope of your predetermined beliefs to challenge their assumptions.

WTF are you blathering on about? We are in complete agreement that Seattle's idiotic policies have destroyed Seattle. How do you get that I am a loony lefty unwilling to challenge my own beliefs? My beliefs evolve constantly as new information comes in. Dude, we've known each other almost 10 years, how can you not know this?

[DBTrek]

So why do you suppose the entire city council in Indiana shit-canned the needle exchange program? You think they all did it for “God”? Did they do it because they hated having HIV rates drop? Or ... were there collateral effects driving that decision, which the progressive media would rather not advertise?

[Kath]

So why do you suppose the entire city council in Indiana shit-canned the needle exchange program? You think they all did it for “God”? Did they do it because they hated having HIV rates drop? Or ... were there collateral effects driving that decision, which the progressive media would rather not advertise?

The article you linked doesn't say why. They cited no "poop on the street," type of stats. From the article.

While most of government is a giant shit-show, the CDC is actually one agency that works, IMO.

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, Johns Hopkins University, the World Health Organization and former Indiana State Health Commissioner-now U.S. Surgeon General Dr. Jerome Adams, however, back evidence that shows the programs are a proven way to prevent disease.

The CDC has reviewed 15 studies that show an association between needle exchanges and a decrease in HIV cases without an increase in drug use.

Adams wrote in a June blog post about the "staggering statistics" that since 2015 — when he helped persuade Mike Pence, as governor of Indiana at the time, to approve the exchanges — 219 people in Scott County had been diagnosed with HIV, and nearly 95 percent of those people were also infected with hepatitis C.

[DBTrek]

Way to cite your God metric again, Kath.
Sure evidence of an open mind.

(But it slightly reduces HIV in addicts!!! Thank you, one-note zealot. We get it)

[Kath]

Way to cite your God metric again, Kath.
Sure evidence of an open mind.

(But it slightly reduces HIV in addicts!!! Thank you, one-note zealot. We get it)

?? I quoted what the CDC, WHO and John Hopkins said. Nothing about god.

[DBTrek]

... Brent Holland, a Madison County councilman, said he based his vote against the program on “numerous reasons, facts, and personal ethics.”

In a lengthy email, Holland said he did not take issue with needle exchange programs’ ability to prevent the spread of disease, “but that’s where it stops.”

Although needle exchange programs may help those who use the drugs, few studies have explored the programs’ effect on the broader community, he wrote. Needle exchange programs could concentrate drug activities in the neighborhoods in which they are placed, affect property values, encourage drug use, and increase the number of dirty needles in public.

In Madison County, the needle exchange program, which ran for just over a year and a half, had a 30 percent rate on needle until its final three months, Holland said. Many of the returned needles were found on sidewalks and yard in the community.

“I think the Needle Exchange Program sanctions bad behavior. It suggests that if you're persistent enough doing the wrong thing, you'll be rewarded with official permission to keep doing it,” Holland said.

https://www.indystar.com/story/news/201 ... 949707001/

Indiana reaping the same rewards as Seattle and San Francisco. Why ... it’s almost a pattern.

[Kath]

Ahhh, so they had a needle distribution program, not a needle exchange program. The article I link has numerous links with some cities getting back more needles then they distribute.

Yes, I'm on record several times saying that if you only hand out needles, it will not succeed.

[DBTrek]

They have a needle exchange program, the article mentioned it explicitly several times. Calling a needle exchange program “needle distribution” when it inevitably fails doesn’t change anything.
/shrug

[Kath]

They have a needle exchange program, the article mentioned it explicitly several times. Calling a needle exchange program “needle distribution” when it inevitably fails doesn’t change anything.
/shrug

I think it does. Good processes utterly fail when they are not followed.

It's all fine and good if a restaurant has a process for cleaning the kitchen, but in order for the kitchen to stay clean, they have to actually follow the process. You wouldn't turn around and say "kitchen cleaning doesn't work, look how disgusting this kitchen is." You'd call the restaurant management a failure for not following the process.

[DBTrek]

They have a needle exchange program, the article mentioned it explicitly several times. Calling a needle exchange program “needle distribution” when it inevitably fails doesn’t change anything.
/shrug

I think it does. Good processes utterly fail when they are not followed.

It's all fine and good if a restaurant has a process for cleaning the kitchen, but in order for the kitchen to stay clean, they have to actually follow the process. You wouldn't turn around and say "kitchen cleaning doesn't work, look how disgusting this kitchen is." You'd call the restaurant management a failure for not following the process.

Apply that same logic to gay conversion therapy.
“Just because many fail doesn’t mean the system doesn’t work. The failures simply aren’t following the process right!”