Seattle Socialists Strangle Golden Goose

[ooky]

Seattle is the problem. New construction is so ridiculously over-regulated that it can add months and tens of thousands to get a new house built.

Whatever you subsidize, you get more of. Giving the homeless everything they need only tells the rest of the homeless in this country, that all they need to do is get to Seattle and life will be easy street.

Seattle should get out of its' own way and let the market handle this. Seattle will be Detroit if they keep being overly hostile to business.

I don't think most of the people I see would be homeless if there was any better choice for them. Again, a lot of them have regular jobs. The washed out drug addicts and total mental cases are a different story, but I don't think those groups see their life as easy street either.

What I see here is that the existing property-owning citizens -- mainly tech workers -- do not want to make it easier to build housing. I have seen them lobby to get developments struck down because they do not want the additional traffic or other potential effects to where they live that happen when you build new housing.

[DBTrek]

It's definitely not all the fault of these companies, but again, they do have a role and will need to be part of the solution. It's a community problem and they are a huge part of the community. Although taxing companies to the point that they leave is not good, it's also not right for these companies to make a killing while not taking any responsibility for the negative effects, and it's not good for any of these areas if the only people who can live there are high paid tech workers, no teachers, janitors, etc etc.

No. You’re feeling fundamentally entitled to play god, but you have neither the experience, character, nor judgment for the role. Companies paying good salaries owe you nothing for the side effects of paying good salries. To suggest that a company somehow owes “the community” more than an opportunity to work for really good pay is both childish and egotistical.

There is no housing “problem” created by great wages, other than entitled but unproductive people feeling that they’re owed a standard of living they can’t afford. The homeless crisis we see in west coast cities isn’t due to great jobs. The people piling up dirty drug needles and shitting on the sidewalk wouldn’t be living in three bedroom houses if only Google didn’t pay so well.

Stop tearing down productive members of society. You’ve admitted yourself that you have no solutions, so keep your grabby, non-solution-having hands out of people’s pockets. What’s so difficult about that?

[ooky]

Your subconscious must be in overdrive to keep you from realizing these are the consequences of your own politics.

My politics are largely unchanged, but the problem has gotten drastically, visibly worse here in the past 4 years since the economic recovery started really picking up pace and there has been massive new growth from multiple large companies in the area. It's more complex than you realize.

[DBTrek]

My politics are largely unchanged, but the problem has gotten drastically, visibly worse here in the past 4 years since the economic recovery started really picking up pace and there has been massive new growth from multiple large companies in the area. It's more complex than you realize.

It’s only complex to people who have no solutions, but are confident that if they just take enough money from others the solution will organically occur.

Yet no matter how much money they take, the solution never appears. Which only convinces them that surely they haven’t taken enough money yet, so it’s time to try again.

When you point out that all they’re doing is ripping off citizens while solving nothing, they tell you the problem is “complex” ... then launch right back into taking more money, because maybe it’ll work this time. After all, complex problems are best tackled by “solutions” that have repeatedly produced zero or negative results.

[Kath]

I have seen them lobby to get developments struck down because they do not want the additional traffic or other potential effects to where they live that happen when you build new housing.

You literally just said that if government got out of the way, there'd be additional housing. Hence why I said, "Seattle needs to get out of its' own way."

[Fife]

There is no housing “problem” created by great wages, other than entitled but unproductive people feeling that they’re owed a standard of living they can’t afford. The homeless crisis we see in west coast cities isn’t due to great jobs. The people piling up dirty drug needles and shitting on the sidewalk wouldn’t be living in three bedroom houses if only Google didn’t pay so well.

Why don't they all hitchhike down to Ephrata? There's no Amazon tyranny glass tower and all their overpaid jobs there, if I'm informed correctly. Housing is probably pretty damn reasonable there; and I'm pretty sure that if you aren't a total asshole Nick will work with you on a bed and some chairs and stuff.

'Tis a mystery, indeed.

:goteam: :drunk:

[ooky]

No. You’re feeling fundamentally entitled to play god, but you have neither the experience, character, nor judgment for the role. Companies paying good salaries owe you nothing for the side effects of paying good salries. To suggest that a company somehow owes “the community” more than an opportunity to work for really good pay is both childish and egotistical.

There is no housing “problem” created by great wages, other than entitled but unproductive people feeling that they’re owed a standard of living they can’t afford. The homeless crisis we see in west coast cities isn’t due to great jobs. The people piling up dirty drug needles and shitting on the sidewalk wouldn’t be living in three bedroom houses if only Google didn’t pay so well.

Stop tearing down productive members of society. You’ve admitted yourself that you have no solutions, so keep your grabby, non-solution-having hands out of people’s pockets. What’s so difficult about that?

YOU don't know enough to play God, *I* do!!

Look, I work closely with and for a lot of these companies and the municipalities that they exist within. Both sides.

These companies want to be a part of the community decisions and benefits. I know for a fact that they like City owned roads and services to be top notch. They want non-infested creek corridors that are safe for recreation too. They want nice communities -- not post apocalyptic hellscapes where 1/3 of the public school children are homeless -- for their workers to live in.

Again, I'd agree with you that a company with a rather small impact on an area has no real obligations. But these companies do not have small impacts on these areas, for the good (because there's that too) or bad. In fact, like I said they may own in fee title substantial percentages of the areas in question. The reason they pay high wages is not specific to CA or WA either - they do that because they are competing for the most qualified workers on a global market. The indirect consequences of that then affect normal middle class people and Bay Area natives that just aren't tech workers.

[Fife]

Seattle is the problem. New construction is so ridiculously over-regulated that it can add months and tens of thousands to get a new house built.

Whatever you subsidize, you get more of. Giving the homeless everything they need only tells the rest of the homeless in this country, that all they need to do is get to Seattle and life will be easy street.

Seattle should get out of its' own way and let the market handle this. Seattle will be Detroit if they keep being overly hostile to business.

Talk dirty to me, Kath.

[Kath]

Talk dirty to me, Kath.

Nerd says, "back off, Barney!"

[DBTrek]

Nothing you said there changes the fact that businesses owe you nothing for offering great jobs. You even changed your tune to “well, they want to help” after realizing how ridiculous your obligation-assigning sounded.

They. Owe. You. Nothing. For. Creating. Great. Jobs.

And you have no solutions, as you’ve mentioned.
So why are you even inflicting your opinions on anyone?
If I had no solutions I certainly wouldn’t be trying to leverage money out of others for literally nothing. What kind of asshole does that?

“I can’t fix what’s wrong, but it needs to be fixed so you owe me $275 per employee”

Sounds like a retard trying to pull a robbery.