Europe, Boring Until it's Not

[TheReal_ND]

Most BOOMERS maybe. We have grown up with the internet and have been consciously reading and writing for more hours of the day than we sleep.

Consciousness is not awareness. It's the cognitive space you have in your mind to model the world and where it becomes possible to model yourself objectively.

This is why primitive people couldn't deceive very well. It's why they would pull a giant Trojan Horse into the city walls. They didn't have the capacity to model things in the way we do.

It's an interesting theory regarding the Trojan Horse but I have heard other theories concerning high trust societies that White races build which would more easily explain the mistake of accepting it.

[JohnDonne]

I could offer all sorts of reasons that the “unethical” behavior of eating meat is not unethical, but you seem to want me to prove that it’s actually more ethical.

Well, given that the survival of your family and species are the top priority (ethically), restricting their food options to a single source is in fact unethical.

The world will not always be as it is now. Life will not always be so secure and easy. And when the next civilizational swing occurs, you want those around you to be best adapted for survival. The best chance for that is as widely varied a diet as possible, along with the personal skills to procure nutrition in any way possible.

Lol, It's important to keep eating steaks in case we forget how.

It takes a period of months for a full-on vegan to adjust back to an omnivorous diet. This is known.

I was speaking more in terms of society though, and personal hunting skills. If we moved everyone to a vegan diet, we would be incredibly vulnerable to crop blights, and - in terms of a civilizational event - vegetables would not even be an option for months, if it happened at the wrong time.

In terms of being vulnerable to blights, we could use the vast amount of land that was monocropped for livestock feed and diversify. Theyre also working on blight resistant gmos, so I hear.

In terms of catastrophic economic collapse, I’m no prepper, but I’d imagine people could eat grains, dried and canned foods, fish and hunt in the wilderness while they rebuild if necessary.

Apocalypse scenarios seem like a thin pretext to continue eating meat, on an individual or societal level.

[SuburbanFarmer]

Exactly. We go back to meat as soon as we need it. And if we lose the skills to do that, or the ability to digest it... buh bye.

[Speaker to Animals]

Lol, It's important to keep eating steaks in case we forget how.

It takes a period of months for a full-on vegan to adjust back to an omnivorous diet. This is known.

I was speaking more in terms of society though, and personal hunting skills. If we moved everyone to a vegan diet, we would be incredibly vulnerable to crop blights, and - in terms of a civilizational event - vegetables would not even be an option for months, if it happened at the wrong time.

In terms of being vulnerable to blights, we could use the vast amount of land that was monocropped for livestock feed and diversify. Theyre also working on blight resistant gmos, so I hear.

In terms of catastrophic economic collapse, I’m no prepper, but I’d imagine people could eat grains, dried and canned foods, fish and hunt in the wilderness while they rebuild if necessary.

Apocalypse scenarios seem like a thin pretext to continue eating meat, on an individual or societal level.

I eat because it is my free choice to do so. I don't need to justify myself for eating a natural human diet, or the closest I can reasonably get to it on my budget. If I had a better budget, I'd be paleo, and yet you don't see me demanding everybody eat like cavemen.

What narcissism and arrogance does one need to demand everybody eat your own special diet, anyway? I mean.. Holy shit. My food choices are not your choices.

[JohnDonne]

Exactly. We go back to meat as soon as we need it. And if we lose the skills to do that, or the ability to digest it... buh bye.

The skills to hunt a deer? Seems like primitive man figured it out without a manual, without machine guns, not sure why you think modern humans with their manuals and machine guns couldn’t hack it.

And there’s no losing the ability to digest meat, and it doesn’t take months to readjust, it takes days.

[JohnDonne]

It takes a period of months for a full-on vegan to adjust back to an omnivorous diet. This is known.

I was speaking more in terms of society though, and personal hunting skills. If we moved everyone to a vegan diet, we would be incredibly vulnerable to crop blights, and - in terms of a civilizational event - vegetables would not even be an option for months, if it happened at the wrong time.

In terms of being vulnerable to blights, we could use the vast amount of land that was monocropped for livestock feed and diversify. Theyre also working on blight resistant gmos, so I hear.

In terms of catastrophic economic collapse, I’m no prepper, but I’d imagine people could eat grains, dried and canned foods, fish and hunt in the wilderness while they rebuild if necessary.

Apocalypse scenarios seem like a thin pretext to continue eating meat, on an individual or societal level.

I eat because it is my free choice to do so. I don't need to justify myself for eating a natural human diet, or the closest I can reasonably get to it on my budget. If I had a better budget, I'd be paleo, and yet you don't see me demanding everybody eat like cavemen.

What narcissism and arrogance does one need to demand everybody eat your own special diet, anyway? I mean.. Holy shit. My food choices are not your choices.

I don’t recognize your supposed right to kill and violate others, and your impression that it is tyranny to suggest that you recognize the rights of other beings is quite ironic. You have no such right, your being under that impression doesn’t change anything, and you didn’t really address the ethical arguments so I assume you have no answer to them.

[Speaker to Animals]

Nobody hunts deer with machine guns. You are so fucking detached from reality there might be nothing that can save you at this point.

[Speaker to Animals]

In terms of being vulnerable to blights, we could use the vast amount of land that was monocropped for livestock feed and diversify. Theyre also working on blight resistant gmos, so I hear.

In terms of catastrophic economic collapse, I’m no prepper, but I’d imagine people could eat grains, dried and canned foods, fish and hunt in the wilderness while they rebuild if necessary.

Apocalypse scenarios seem like a thin pretext to continue eating meat, on an individual or societal level.

I eat because it is my free choice to do so. I don't need to justify myself for eating a natural human diet, or the closest I can reasonably get to it on my budget. If I had a better budget, I'd be paleo, and yet you don't see me demanding everybody eat like cavemen.

What narcissism and arrogance does one need to demand everybody eat your own special diet, anyway? I mean.. Holy shit. My food choices are not your choices.

I don’t recognize your supposed right to kill and violate others, and your impression that it is tyranny to suggest that you recognize the rights of other beings is quite ironic. You have no such right, your being under that impression doesn’t change anything, and you didn’t really address the ethical arguments so I assume you have no answer to them.

If you try to control my diet like a fucking Vegan commie cunt, and it ever looks like you could actually get away with it, I will bury you and your vegan friends in mass graves. We all will. Bet that.

If you cannot convince people to convert to your bizarre diet religion, then you fucking lost. You just lost. If you want to become zealots who try to take over the world in some vegan theocracy, then we are going to kill you.

[JohnDonne]

Most humans are not conscious but for a few moments out of the day, and at some point in recorded history, there were few if any conscious humans. Consciousness is a cultural invention that arises from the neural plasticity of the human brain combined with written language. You can just look at thge interactions between the Spanish.and the Inca to see how that plays out. Conscious humans were historically freaked the fuck out by non-conscious humans. From the other side's perspective, our capacity for deception is pretty fucked up. This is why something as stupid as a Trojan Horse, or driving the Incan emperor into surrendering himself like that was ever possible.

Animals do not possess consciousness. I love my dogs to death, but they only possess a vague concept of me, not an "I".

If we’re going to assume an anti-intuitive fringe theory of consciousness for our ethical decisions could we have some actual proof?

[JohnDonne]

Nobody hunts deer with machine guns. You are so fucking detached from reality there might be nothing that can save you at this point.

Try not to take witty retorts literally and pretend confusion, especially when the point stands.