F*** WORK

[Fife]

I'm re-posting this from some other UBI thread to present opposite views on the topic. Some of you might like to read, listen, and then think a little bit; and then pick a side of the argument and defend it.

*******

Here's your new mantra, UBI fans: Fuck work

Economists believe in full employment. Americans think that work builds character. But what if jobs aren’t working anymore?

Work means everything to us Americans. For centuries – since, say, 1650 – we’ve believed that it builds character (punctuality, initiative, honesty, self-discipline, and so forth). We’ve also believed that the market in labour, where we go to find work, has been relatively efficient in allocating opportunities and incomes. And we’ve believed that, even if it sucks, a job gives meaning, purpose and structure to our everyday lives – at any rate, we’re pretty sure that it gets us out of bed, pays the bills, makes us feel responsible, and keeps us away from daytime TV.

These beliefs are no longer plausible. In fact, they’ve become ridiculous, because there’s not enough work to go around, and what there is of it won’t pay the bills – unless of course you’ve landed a job as a drug dealer or a Wall Street banker, becoming a gangster either way.

Here's a mild rebuke of this utter nonsense: http://tomwoods.com/ep-934-time-for-peo ... out-a-job/

A Rutgers professor suggests it’s time we dropped our emphasis on jobs and work — many jobs are highly undesirable, and with automation the number of jobs is going to fall substantially anyway. And what’s so great about work? Think of the creativity that would emerge if we didn’t have to do them.

Peter Klein and I go through his article and respond.

[Zlaxer]

This issue really comes down to whether one believes that 80%+ of jobs will be automated in the next 50-100 years or not.

If people can find work - then they should.....but if they can't, then what?

[DBTrek]

Indeed.
Look at that cultural Renaissance of art and creativity exploding from Zimbabwe (unemployment 95%), American Samoa (unemployment 49.9%), and Djibouti (unemployment 60%). I mean, who could possibly argue against innovation and creativity like that, right? Obviously when people aren't working they're absolutely killing themselves to give back to society in other ways.

[Hanarchy Montanarchy]

Duh! This is what a Renaissance looks like!

[Martin Hash]

Indeed.
Look at that cultural Renaissance of art and creativity exploding from Zimbabwe (unemployment 95%), American Samoa (unemployment 49.9%), and Djibouti (unemployment 60%). I mean, who could possibly argue against innovation and creativity like that, right? Obviously when people aren't working they're absolutely killing themselves to give back to society in other ways.

Oh, nice. Can't touch that.

[C-Mag]

Indeed.
Look at that cultural Renaissance of art and creativity exploding from Zimbabwe (unemployment 95%), American Samoa (unemployment 49.9%), and Djibouti (unemployment 60%). I mean, who could possibly argue against innovation and creativity like that, right? Obviously when people aren't working they're absolutely killing themselves to give back to society in other ways.

Oh, nice. Can't touch that.

Well done DB !

I was going to suggest to the Rutgers Professor that we get rid of all the tenured professor positions as that is work. Should he want to spread knowledge he can do it at the local coffee shop for free.

[SuburbanFarmer]

Work builds character (punctuality, initiative, honesty, self-discipline, and so forth)

Work does those things, but the point is whether you need to work for someone else in order to gain those effects.

Re: Zimbabwe unemployment - Those people are most definitely working their asses off to survive, just not on official payrolls. If they were idle with a secure living, then you probably would see an explosion of culture. That's not the case when your kids are starving in front of you, and you have to raid the local UN depot, or kill your neighbor for rice.

[Okeefenokee]

Well, what about my ice age game reserve idea?

[SuburbanFarmer]

Well, what about my ice age game reserve idea?

Forward to prosperity!

[Okeefenokee]

I think it would provide jobs, and the those elites who have all the tech jobs would pay to see it.

Medieval tournament, but full contact, and not in some stadium full of peasants, that's the next idea.