United Airlines beats the shit out of passenger

Smitty-48
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Re: United Airlines beats the shit out of passenger

Post by Smitty-48 » Fri Apr 14, 2017 10:17 am

Speaker to Animals wrote:LOL, United is collapsing because of this, so obviously Smitty ain't representative of any civil society.
I'm not seeing any "collapsing", they're down to $69 from $70, which is way up from when they were at $41, so even if Mr. Miyagi got a little bump on the head, I don't see investors abandoning United, because it's actually a cash cow.

The only real reason to dump United, is that they've stopped paying a dividend, but other than that, they've been going like gangbusters.

Newsflash, United stock has tripled in five years, any near term dip due to do internet outrage, is actually a buying oppotunity.

Internet outrage doesn't last, as soon as the next jingly keys comes along, like next week, Mr. Miyagi will be totally forgotten, meanwhile, United will still be a cash cow, so he better get paid quick, cause his 15 minutes of fame is about to end.
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K@th
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Re: United Airlines beats the shit out of passenger

Post by K@th » Fri Apr 14, 2017 10:30 am

I gotta say that some of you really don't know what's in the fine print of your airline ticket.

It is federal law that the airline MUST bump a paying passenger in favor of a non-rev if the purpose of the non-rev trip is to get crew to another flight so that another flight won't be delayed. They weren't helping their own employees get to their favorite vacation spot quicker. Simple non-revs on vacation can't bump a paying passenger. That is against the airline's interest.

These are called non-revs/must fly. An airline may NOT delay a flight due to lack of crew if they have the ability to get the crew to the airport in time. They can't "choose" to send the non-rev on a later flight.
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heydaralon
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Re: United Airlines beats the shit out of passenger

Post by heydaralon » Fri Apr 14, 2017 10:37 am

I think United Airlines roughed that guy up as payback for Virginia Tech
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Martin Hash
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Re: United Airlines beats the shit out of passenger

Post by Martin Hash » Fri Apr 14, 2017 11:08 am

Kath wrote:I gotta say that some of you really don't know what's in the fine print of your airline ticket.

It is federal law that the airline MUST bump a paying passenger in favor of a non-rev if the purpose of the non-rev trip is to get crew to another flight so that another flight won't be delayed. They weren't helping their own employees get to their favorite vacation spot quicker. Simple non-revs on vacation can't bump a paying passenger. That is against the airline's interest.

These are called non-revs/must fly. An airline may NOT delay a flight due to lack of crew if they have the ability to get the crew to the airport in time. They can't "choose" to send the non-rev on a later flight.
We'll see how the "fine print" holds up in Civil Court?

p.s. There was a guy on the flight willing to give up his ticket for $1400. Seems Slam-Dunk to me but maybe you & Smitty will be on the jury. (Still need one more though.)
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Penner
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Re: United Airlines beats the shit out of passenger

Post by Penner » Fri Apr 14, 2017 11:08 am

Kath wrote:I gotta say that some of you really don't know what's in the fine print of your airline ticket.

It is federal law that the airline MUST bump a paying passenger in favor of a non-rev if the purpose of the non-rev trip is to get crew to another flight so that another flight won't be delayed. They weren't helping their own employees get to their favorite vacation spot quicker. Simple non-revs on vacation can't bump a paying passenger. That is against the airline's interest.

These are called non-revs/must fly. An airline may NOT delay a flight due to lack of crew if they have the ability to get the crew to the airport in time. They can't "choose" to send the non-rev on a later flight.

Still though, this story is another reminder why flying today sucks.
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TheOneX
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Re: United Airlines beats the shit out of passenger

Post by TheOneX » Fri Apr 14, 2017 11:12 am

Kath wrote:I gotta say that some of you really don't know what's in the fine print of your airline ticket.

It is federal law that the airline MUST bump a paying passenger in favor of a non-rev if the purpose of the non-rev trip is to get crew to another flight so that another flight won't be delayed. They weren't helping their own employees get to their favorite vacation spot quicker. Simple non-revs on vacation can't bump a paying passenger. That is against the airline's interest.

These are called non-revs/must fly. An airline may NOT delay a flight due to lack of crew if they have the ability to get the crew to the airport in time. They can't "choose" to send the non-rev on a later flight.
Legality of it doesn't really matter to me. It was their own incompetence that created this situation. United should have had a better plan for getting their employees to where they needed to be. Either have those seats reserved for those employees beforehand, or if it is an emergency bounce the customers before they board the plane. Once they are on the plane they have no excuse to throw someone off. At that point they should be either finding some other way to get their employees there, such as buying tickets from another airline, finding a replacement crew, or accepting that they screwed up and face the legal consequences like an adult. I have very little doubt those legal consequences would be minor compared to this PR disaster.

Smitty-48
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Re: United Airlines beats the shit out of passenger

Post by Smitty-48 » Fri Apr 14, 2017 11:19 am

Martin Hash wrote:Seems Slam-Dunk to me but maybe you & Smitty will be on the jury. (Still need one more though.)
I don't actually have a beef with Mr. Miyagi getting paid, if he can run his self victimization scam on a jury or get a settlement from United just to make him go away, more power to him, that's fair enough, get dat paper, but I'm not actually going to cry for a self victimizing man-baby mugging for a payday, nor do I give any fucks whatsoever about internet faux outrage, which, on the aggregate, is the scourge of our times, and in the end causes far more damage than good.
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K@th
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Re: United Airlines beats the shit out of passenger

Post by K@th » Fri Apr 14, 2017 11:28 am

TheOneX wrote: Legality of it doesn't really matter to me. It was their own incompetence that created this situation. United should have had a better plan for getting their employees to where they needed to be. Either have those seats reserved for those employees beforehand, or if it is an emergency bounce the customers before they board the plane. Once they are on the plane they have no excuse to throw someone off. At that point they should be either finding some other way to get their employees there, such as buying tickets from another airline, finding a replacement crew, or accepting that they screwed up and face the legal consequences like an adult. I have very little doubt those legal consequences would be minor compared to this PR disaster.
Having a pilot in the family for the last 30 years has given me some perspective on this. Americans want their air travel to be comfortable, fast and cheap. These goals are incompatible with each other.

An airline sending a half empty plane is losing money on that flight. Overbooking is never going to stop because the reality is that if they didn't overbook flights, most of them would fly with empty seats. It's silly to model that way. Hotels don't do it, busy restaurants don't do it - most industries who take reservations only books 1:1, simply because human nature doesn't change. (I don't believe this is true for sporting events, concerts, etc., though.)

It is entirely possible that the airline already scoped out another flight, but if this flight was the earliest, they were required by law to get them on the earliest possible flight, which was likely the flight that was just leaving. I don't know all the circumstances, but it's entirely possible that this crew was needed at the last minute, due to another crew already in KY not being able to fly. (Perhaps the pilot on the original crew got sick.) These things happen. I don't have special insight, I don't believe all the little details were disclosed.

So, that said, yes, it was a brutal removal, but (and this is the biggie,) passengers do not have any right to stay on the plane no matter what. If you force their hand, they aren't going to say, "Oh, okay, you really mean it. We'll let you stay." If they do that one time, now it's policy and anyone could get away with it. That gives all passengers the ability to completely fuck up air travel for thousands of people. That's the alternative, so they had to show force.

United had a legal duty to not delay their flight out of KY, so they had to get their crew there. That's all there is to it.
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Martin Hash
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Re: United Airlines beats the shit out of passenger

Post by Martin Hash » Fri Apr 14, 2017 11:42 am

TheOneX wrote:
Kath wrote:I gotta say that some of you really don't know what's in the fine print of your airline ticket.

It is federal law that the airline MUST bump a paying passenger in favor of a non-rev if the purpose of the non-rev trip is to get crew to another flight so that another flight won't be delayed. They weren't helping their own employees get to their favorite vacation spot quicker. Simple non-revs on vacation can't bump a paying passenger. That is against the airline's interest.

These are called non-revs/must fly. An airline may NOT delay a flight due to lack of crew if they have the ability to get the crew to the airport in time. They can't "choose" to send the non-rev on a later flight.
Legality of it doesn't really matter to me. It was their own incompetence that created this situation. United should have had a better plan for getting their employees to where they needed to be. Either have those seats reserved for those employees beforehand, or if it is an emergency bounce the customers before they board the plane. Once they are on the plane they have no excuse to throw someone off. At that point they should be either finding some other way to get their employees there, such as buying tickets from another airline, finding a replacement crew, or accepting that they screwed up and face the legal consequences like an adult. I have very little doubt those legal consequences would be minor compared to this PR disaster.
Bam! Plaintiff attorney just needs to read this to the jury & 6 people need to agree.
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Penner
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Re: United Airlines beats the shit out of passenger

Post by Penner » Fri Apr 14, 2017 11:54 am

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