Coronavirus thread

[Martin Hash]

There won’t be a vaccine (eventually, maybe?), there won’t be a drug (never), lockdown actually weakens people’s immune systems, “flattening the curve” turned out to be bullshit (same rates in Sweden & Brazil without lockdowns). It’s all total sanctimonious posturing & Trump-hating.

p.s. Thx, DB, for having the patience to push back against the demagogue authoritarian-lovers; it gives other posters some room.

[SuburbanFarmer]

Generally, a few possible categories of outcomes:

(a) Maintain social isolation until we have adequate test capacity to safely reopen. Economy suffers but we keep it mostly intact with stimulus bills and various schemes.

In other words, continue to debase the currency into hyper-inflation.

(b) Maintain social isolation until we have adequate test capacity to safely reopen and the economy collapses because the government is incapable or unwilling to implement emergency actions to keep us afloat (real possibility).

Very likely.

(c) Reopen economy even though we have no community testing to save the economy and scientific models are wrong -- we don't see huge spikes in fatalities, the entire health care sector does not collapse, and our economy is not destroyed instead of just enduring a second great depression.

This will never be allowed, or people would lose their shit on our feckless senators.

(d) Reopen economy even though we have no community testing to save the economy and scientific models are correct -- scientists were correct and we suffer 2.2 million fatalities, several times that in permanently disabled, and our economy collapses rather than just a depression. (This is a very real outcome of reopening that some of you refuse to acknowledge)

This will never be allowed, or people would lose their shit on our feckless senators.

Right now (C) and (D) are the only outcomes we will have. Either republicans are right or the scientists are right. If the scientific models are right, you are getting something along the lines of outcome (D). If the science is wrong, then you will get outcome (C). Outcome (C) would be awesome but magical, wishful thinking is not a reasonable justification.

And I’m telling you that C and D are impossible from a game theory standpoint. The politicians can’t reopen without being blamed for either over- or under-reacting. That’s why we see all the flip-flopping and instability in government policy right now.

The only safe option for them is to stay closed or semi-closed - which will lead to their absurd overreach becoming ‘The New Normal’, no matter what. There’s a perfect boogeyman in place, possibly for years.

[Fife]

Let's call one strategy "Economy-First" and the other "Fear-First."

"Prior Restraint" seems to fit as a good name for one of the strategies also. There's a robust history of how that strategy works out for individuals.

[Hanarchy Montanarchy]

There won’t be a vaccine (eventually, maybe?), there won’t be a drug (never), lockdown actually weakens people’s immune systems

It is like we are trying to win a siege war against an enemy that can not die and never grows tired, and we are waiting for reinforcements in the form of vaccines or drugs that will never come.

There are some military history buffs left around here - doesn't look good does it.

[TheReal_ND]

More people die from homosexualy transmitted disease world wide every year. We should quarantine faggots.

[TheReal_ND]

We can put them all in a camp. We will call it the YMCA. The C stands for cocks.

[DBTrek]

It's 2020. We quarantine everyone - even the healthy. So ... you know, may want to take it easy on the quarantining. We're not only locking up the sick, like in the old days.

[TheReal_ND]

It's 2020. We quarantine everyone - even the healthy. So ... you know, may want to take it easy on the quarantining. We're not only locking up the sick, like in the old days.

We can bring back sequestering then. We can start with the border.

[Montegriffo]

There won’t be a vaccine (eventually, maybe?), there won’t be a drug (never), lockdown actually weakens people’s immune systems, “flattening the curve” turned out to be bullshit (same rates in Sweden & Brazil without lockdowns). It’s all total sanctimonious posturing & Trump-hating.

p.s. Thx, DB, for having the patience to push back against the demagogue authoritarian-lovers; it gives other posters some room.

I know that you are averse to actually reading up on a subject before you make sweeping statements and overuse the word sanctimonious but in the case of Sweden, you should try to be better informed.
I know it is popular to claim that Sweden is carrying on as normal in order to make an argument that lockdowns don't work. It's not actually true though.
Colleges have been shut down, gatherings of over 50 people are banned as are visits to elderly care homes, non-essential travel has been vastly reduced. Social distancing recommendations are being observed, people are working from home where possible, the use of public transport has reduced significantly, bars may still be open but they are running at only 25% of normal trade and making losses.
The main difference is that most social distancing measures have been voluntary rather than enforced. They are actually being observed at higher rates than many countries which have made them mandatory. Up to 90% compliance with staying apart by more than a meter according to some polls.
Shops may be allowed to stay open but that doesn't mean people are using them as they normally would.
Yet, even allowing for the high rates of voluntary compliance with social distancing recommendations Sweden has higher rates of infection than their Scandinavian neighbours with stricter rules.

[TheReal_ND]

There won’t be a vaccine (eventually, maybe?), there won’t be a drug (never), lockdown actually weakens people’s immune systems, “flattening the curve” turned out to be bullshit (same rates in Sweden & Brazil without lockdowns). It’s all total sanctimonious posturing & Trump-hating.

p.s. Thx, DB, for having the patience to push back against the demagogue authoritarian-lovers; it gives other posters some room.

I know that you are averse to actually reading up on a subject before you make sweeping statements and overuse the word sanctimonious but in the case of Sweden, you should try to be better informed.
I know it is popular to claim that Sweden is carrying on as normal in order to make an argument that lockdowns don't work. It's not actually true though.
Colleges have been shut down, gatherings of over 50 people are banned as are visits to elderly care homes, non-essential travel has been vastly reduced. Social distancing recommendations are being observed, people are working from home where possible, the use of public transport has reduced significantly, bars may still be open but they are running at only 25% of normal trade and making losses.
The main difference is that most social distancing measures have been voluntary rather than enforced. They are actually being observed at higher rates than many countries which have made them mandatory. Up to 90% compliance with staying apart by more than a meter according to some polls.
Shops may be allowed to stay open but that doesn't mean people are using them as they normally would.
Yet, even allowing for the high rates of voluntary compliance with social distancing recommendations Sweden has higher rates of infection than their Scandinavian neighbours with stricter rules.

Wrong