Europe, Boring Until it's Not

[C-Mag]

Best Wishes to our British Allies. I hate to see this shit happening. This should not be something we get used to, accept or minimize in any way.

Nor should we let it turn us into scared peoples or change our moderate societies into far right police states where our freedom and privacy is eroded unnecessarily.
There is a difference between minimising and having a balanced view of the situation.

So, you think I'm scared. No not at all, I'm willing to face up to violence and hatred and call it out for what it is. You don't need police states to take care of this issue, you need courage.

[ssu]

I don't understand why the EU takes the immigration policy the way they do. It seems to me like there may be benefits to having some sort of confederacy but why would you agree to open borders and people from Poland being allowed to work in England for example? It doesn't make sense. The Eurocrats must have really been hitting the koolaid hard when they decided their was no more need for national sovereignty.

The Poland thing is understandable: Poland is in the EU. That people can study or work in other countries has it's benefits too. Not to hassle with Passports and different kind of visas is nice, even if I liked the stamps on my passport as a child. And when there are differences between wealth and job opportunities, migrations happen. Just like you have in the US.

And as a) there are many Poles, b) Polish wages are far lower than in the Western Europe, and finally c) Poland has an rather educated and skilled labour force compared to Third World countries, it's a no-brainer that the Polish would migrate. Hence there has been a huge influx of Polacks to example to the UK. And simply when you are talking about half a million people, that surely will is noticeable in the streetview... if they live together. Especially when Poles make such a huge portion (half a million) of the 3 million EU citizens living in the UK.

What's actually interesting is that the UK isn't the country which has the biggest share of people from other EU countries inside it's borders. Only 4,8% of the population in the UK are people born in other EU member states. In Belgium that is a whopping 7,6% and in Ireland 9,6%. The Irish have as there nuisance the British, naturally.

Chart from 2015 showing just how many EU-nationals are living in other EU countries:


Here's another map of this, the numbers are different because what is counted are all the World, not just the EU:


The lax immigration policies from countries outside the EU and especially the permissive refugee policies are in my view a more universal leftist thing, not something inherently or structurally emerging from the EU itself. The EU is just has been dominated by leftists, simple as that. And likely they would as dominating (and annoying) even without an EU, unfortunately.

[TheReal_ND]

You still haven't sold me on why England would want Polish workers. They drive down wages just the same as our Mexicans. Where is the positive?

[de officiis]

So, what's the solution?

Is there a solution?

Should we even talk about solutions?

Live with it and do nothing...
Live with it and do nothing...
Live with it and do nothing...

Supporting rather than ridiculing our intelligence services is a good start. At least 13 major terrorist attacks have been foiled since 2013 according to security forces in the UK.
Forging links with moderate Muslims in the community rather than alienating them is a good source of information about radical Islamists. No one is suggesting that we do nothing but demonising a whole religion like the panic monkeys do is definitely counter productive.

Who isn't supporting your intelligence services?

Who in the UK are alienating "moderate" muslims?

[Hanarchy Montanarchy]

So, what's the solution?

Is there a solution?

Should we even talk about solutions?

Live with it and do nothing...
Live with it and do nothing...
Live with it and do nothing...

Supporting rather than ridiculing our intelligence services is a good start. At least 13 major terrorist attacks have been foiled since 2013 according to security forces in the UK.
Forging links with moderate Muslims in the community rather than alienating them is a good source of information about radical Islamists. No one is suggesting that we do nothing but demonising a whole religion like the panic monkeys do is definitely counter productive.

Who isn't supporting your intelligence services?

Who in the UK are alienating "moderate" muslims?

Well, they aren't from the UK, but the Southern Poverty Law Center (I think) put Maajid Nawaz, who is a moderate UK Muslim, on a list of 'Islamaphobes,' undermining his good work, and possibly putting him in serious danger.

Moderate Muslims who really do believe in a free and open civil society get a short shrift all over the world, while extremists get cover from apologist chuds like Reza Aslan or CAIR.

[Speaker to Animals]

What is a moderate Muslim? Are we talking about somebody who doesn't really believe in Islam?

[tue4t]

Best Wishes to our British Allies. I hate to see this shit happening. This should not be something we get used to, accept or minimize in any way.

Nor should we let it turn us into scared peoples or change our moderate societies into far right police states where our freedom and privacy is eroded unnecessarily.
There is a difference between minimising and having a balanced view of the situation.

The far left is also a "police state" and has been quite prominent for several years now. "Far right" nationalism is just a defensive symptomatic response of one type of authoritarian system to another. It's a fever to the disease that is social marxism. If you want to get rid of the far right, you must address the far left.

Anyway, as for the UK being moderate, didn't you guys just pass the snoopers charter? I think you'll be alright though, British culture seems quite resilient to swings in left/right politics. It's most of western Europe that's the worry - they really drank the marxist koolaid.

[Hanarchy Montanarchy]

What is a moderate Muslim? Are we talking about somebody who doesn't really believe in Islam?

That is probably how I would put it, but I am an unrepentant sinner and an atheist. The extent that some is or isn't religious ain't really my wheelhouse.

The efforts a lot of these people put towards communicating with other Muslims, and trying to encourage meaningful Islamic reformation is real though.

[Speaker to Animals]

What is a moderate Muslim? Are we talking about somebody who doesn't really believe in Islam?

That is probably how I would put it, but I am an unrepentant sinner and an atheist. The extent that some is or isn't religious ain't really my wheelhouse.

The efforts a lot of these people put towards communicating with other Muslims, and trying to encourage meaningful Islamic reformation is real though.

My main concern is how so many of the major terrorists in recent years started out as "lapsed Muslims", or whatever you want to call it, and then radicalized.

There's not going to be an Islamic reformation, by the way, and even if there was, it would only make it worse. Even in Christianity, the Reformation created genocides in Europe.

[C-Mag]

Best Wishes to our British Allies. I hate to see this shit happening. This should not be something we get used to, accept or minimize in any way.

Nor should we let it turn us into scared peoples or change our moderate societies into far right police states where our freedom and privacy is eroded unnecessarily.
There is a difference between minimising and having a balanced view of the situation.

The far left is also a "police state" and has been quite prominent for several years now. "Far right" nationalism is just a defensive symptomatic response of one type of authoritarian system to another. It's a fever to the disease that is social marxism. If you want to get rid of the far right, you must address the far left.

Anyway, as for the UK being moderate, didn't you guys just pass the snoopers charter? I think you'll be alright though, British culture seems quite resilient to swings in left/right politics. It's most of western Europe that's the worry - they really drank the marxist koolaid.

+1
Good Post, and to Hashwerks!

Doesn't London have one of the highest number of cameras, if not the most ?