What is the Chance of an Electoral College Revolt?

[clubgop]

The easiest way to simplify it would be to allow states to secede, and then do a pure popular vote. Then the outcome would be more representative due to the smaller pool of voters.

Other than that, I'm open to ideas. Except the ones that allow 4 cities to have more sway than 4 states. That's silly.

I think ranked choice and seats based on percentage would help solve a lot of our problems. I just don't know how that would solve this Presidential election problem we're arguing about

Presidential Election problem? I see no problem. I see a bunch of urbanites whining because their rhetoric effectively marginalized the white working class, costing them the presidency.

Indeed. California is a broken state it is three weeks after an election and they are still "finding" votes numbering into six digits. The electoral college protect my vote from the criminal corrupt political machines that run our cities. What British/American system of government holds direct election of thier executive? None that I think of. The bastards of the democrat party have the gall to hold up the US Constitution and lecture on its contents but months later want to bitch about the part on winning the fucking election. Good luck trying to find 38 states to ratify your mob rule. You lost get over it.

[Paulo]

The speech in Ohio, that was great, that was some MAGA shit right there, he's coming out of campaign mode and getting serious now, move over Ronald Reagan, there's a new MAGA in town, he got Carrier to stay for a $7 million dollar concession? Colour me impressed, that doesn't even meet the threshold of walking around money for the Big Gov, can't do that every time, none the less, a win's a win. Plus Mattis.

How fine it is, really? So any company can do that? I guess they will. Keep winning and who is paying for that? How nice to see how americans learned to keep jobs like we did here in Brasil 20 years ago. So bad that they keep asking for more favors until they moved to China.
A win is a win.

To a certain extent, all economic activity is incentivized, I don't support full on government paid make work, because that is just the snake eating its own tail, but where you can come in and keep a job with incentives, at a reasonable percentage, I think that's OK, the looming threat of the stick, UTX government contracts being reevaluated, must have been what Trump had in one hand, in the other, he made a reasonable concession on taxes, as a limited government conservative, I certainly do not oppose lowering taxes as an incentive, where those taxes are actually a tax on productivity, and as such, regressive.

This is a perfect example of Trump the Moderate, Big Gov to the rescue, but not by direct intervention, simply by adjusting the incentive structure. Could it be done in every case? No, but a lot more of it could be done, and if Trump goes that route, he will be popular with the masses, even if not with the elites.

Sorry, but I don't get how you can go from to factory to factory offering tax cuts or "incentives" . If you do for one you have to do for all. And what about competition? the good old capitalism? will those factories incentives be called "food tickects" ? They are not sucking in the gov tit's ?

Sure you can rationalize all kind of BS, but it is pure and simple "getting help money " from the government. It does not work! It will make the owner a bit richer before he move on to China.

My anterior question remains, how many people voted in the US ?

[Smitty-48]

Sorry, but I don't get how you can go from to factory to factory offering tax cuts or "incentives" . If you do for one you have to do for all. And what about competition? the good old capitalism? will those factories incentives be called "food tickects" ? They are not sucking in the gov tit's ?

Sure you can rationalize all kind of BS, but it is pure and simple "getting help money " from the government. It does not work! It will make the owner a bit richer before he move on to China.

I'd cut the corporate tax rate to zero, and if I was going to look for revenue, I'd replace it with a consumption tax, you're whole idea of taxing productivity, is economically nonsensical to me, the fact that they are charging any income taxes on Carrier at all, is counterproductive, that's not where I want to get the revenue from anyways, so if Donald Trump incentivizes by reducing the tax burden on a company in order to make a deal so to keep families gainfully employed rather than on the government dole, that's fine by me, good idea.

[Okeefenokee]

I have been coming around to the idea that corporate taxes are a bad idea. Everyone working for a corporation pays taxes. Why is the company itself paying taxes? I thought corporations weren't people? Why are we taxing them like they are?

[Ex-California]

I have been coming around to the idea that corporate taxes are a bad idea. Everyone working for a corporation pays taxes. Why is the company itself paying taxes? I thought corporations weren't people? Why are we taxing them like they are?

I go back and forth on this. On one hand I am all for separating corporations from any vestige of personhood, but on the other hand it makes our tax plan even more regressive if the entities that make and possess the most amount of money are exempt from contributing their fair share.

I really don't have any answers for taxation besides PLEASE SIMPLIFY IT

[Smitty-48]

I have been coming around to the idea that corporate taxes are a bad idea. Everyone working for a corporation pays taxes. Why is the company itself paying taxes? I thought corporations weren't people? Why are we taxing them like they are?

You tax incorporated income due to an ideologically misguided application of "fairness", paying their ostensibly "fair share", as opposed to taking a rational approach that, as the activity is productive, and something you want to encourage, it is not something that you want to suppress by taxing it, revenue is best sought elsewhere, at the consumption end of things, where the richer you are, and the more you spend, the more tax you pay, without any loopholes therein, because it is a value added tax which comes at the point of transaction.

[Ex-California]

I have been coming around to the idea that corporate taxes are a bad idea. Everyone working for a corporation pays taxes. Why is the company itself paying taxes? I thought corporations weren't people? Why are we taxing them like they are?

You tax incorporated income due to an ideologically misguided application of "fairness", paying their ostensibly "fair share", as opposed to taking a rational approach that, as the activity is productive, and something you want to encourage, it is not something that you want to suppress by taxing it, revenue is best sought elsewhere, at the consumption end of things, where the richer you are, and the more you spend, the more tax you pay, without any loopholes therein, because it is a value added tax which comes at the point of transaction.

This makes really good sense, and simplifies the mess.

How is it not regressive though Smitty? Would it be applied to food?

[Smitty-48]

I would apply it to processed food, but I'm only talking a 10% VAT here, so you don't want to get into too many loopholes, because what happens is, everybody has a sob story about why this or that shouldn't have the VAT applied, and pretty soon, you have so many exemptions that you're not taking in the revenue you need.

Bear in mind, and you must beware, it has to be a replacement, you don't want the government taxing everything, because they'll try to have their cake and eat it too, they'll add the VAT, while retaining the regressive taxes as well, then you lose you job because they taxed the productive activity right out of the country, and then that 10% VAT is going to sting because you're counting every penny then.

If you free up the productivity, then you have the jobs, so you don't care anymore about a 10% VAT, or at least, you can well afford it. And then it becomes a virtuous cycle, more jobs, more people buying more as a result, generating more revenue by increased consumption.

[Smitty-48]

And bear in mind, just as okee said, corporate tax is the triple dip, because you're already taxing the income of all the employees of the corporation, and you're taxing the profits the share holders are drawing from it, so even if you remove the regressive tax on productivity, you're still taxing the shit out of corporate activity, personal income and capital gains.

[Ex-California]

Yeah, you guys convinced me of this last year.

And since the big corps don't pay anything anyway it would make operating costs a lot better for the small guys