Public School Education System Thread

[Smitty-48]

There are still great Protestant high schools in Ontario, the best in fact, but they are private; Upper Canada College and St. Andrew's College.





Tuition will run your between $30k for day school to $60k for boarding.

[K@th]

Ahh, I see now. So you're willing to allow Darwinian education to play out over a generation or so, for the system to correct itself?

That's hardcore.... I like it, but I have kids...

I think our school system has already been in epic fail mode for generations. Like I said, I have a 22-year old working at 7-11 because HS did not prepare him for the work college was going to take. As soon as he found out his grades were based on his actual work, he bailed. Now he's a struggling 22 year old trying to figure out why the world didn't offer him a $75K/year job just for being cute.

[apeman]

States as laboratories.

[SuburbanFarmer]

Ahh, I see now. So you're willing to allow Darwinian education to play out over a generation or so, for the system to correct itself?

That's hardcore.... I like it, but I have kids...

I think our school system has already been in epic fail mode for generations. Like I said, I have a 22-year old working at 7-11 because HS did not prepare him for the work college was going to take. As soon as he found out his grades were based on his actual work, he bailed. Now he's a struggling 22 year old trying to figure out why the world didn't offer him a $75K/year job just for being cute.

I had a similar issue in my 20s. Just encourage him to go back in a few years, after lower-class life kicks his ass for a few years.
I went back to school around 30 and started my actual career, once I realized how hard it is without.

It took me a few extra years, because I had a sweet poker-dealing gig for a while.

[Dand]

Well, aside from your feels, the actual metrics we possess on the matter show religious schools vastly outperforming government schools, and government schools actually passing a significant number of illiterate students, depriving them of a meaningful economic future, and resulting in several high-profile court battles (in which the government school districts lost).

No feels here. As I said: I can't deny that they're very good schools for the TEM in STEM.

But that does not an education make.

How much do you actually retain from your final 4 years of school - whatever level it was? How much of that is STEM, and how much is philosophy, critical thought, and the ability to reason?

You've already got your bias against religious school but if you think that most or all of them teach creationism or deny science, you are wrong. Plenty of religious schools exist where students manage to study science (including evolution ! ), attend religious services, and perform well on exams all at the same time.

[apeman]

Ahh, I see now. So you're willing to allow Darwinian education to play out over a generation or so, for the system to correct itself?

That's hardcore.... I like it, but I have kids...

I think our school system has already been in epic fail mode for generations. Like I said, I have a 22-year old working at 7-11 because HS did not prepare him for the work college was going to take. As soon as he found out his grades were based on his actual work, he bailed. Now he's a struggling 22 year old trying to figure out why the world didn't offer him a $75K/year job just for being cute.

I had a similar issue in my 20s. Just encourage him to go back in a few years, after lower-class life kicks his ass for a few years.
I went back to school around 30 and started my actual career, once I realized how hard it is without.

It took me a few extra years, because I had a sweet poker-dealing gig for a while.

Not a good narrative to hold out in support of the public education system.

[SuburbanFarmer]

Well, aside from your feels, the actual metrics we possess on the matter show religious schools vastly outperforming government schools, and government schools actually passing a significant number of illiterate students, depriving them of a meaningful economic future, and resulting in several high-profile court battles (in which the government school districts lost).

No feels here. As I said: I can't deny that they're very good schools for the TEM in STEM.

But that does not an education make.

How much do you actually retain from your final 4 years of school - whatever level it was? How much of that is STEM, and how much is philosophy, critical thought, and the ability to reason?

You've already got your bias against religious school but if you think that most or all of them teach creationism or deny science, you are wrong. Plenty of religious schools exist where students manage to study science (including evolution ! ), attend religious services, and perform well on exams all at the same time.

Then I would support such a school, the same as any other. However, you know very well that that would not be the standard across all of them.

[SuburbanFarmer]

I think our school system has already been in epic fail mode for generations. Like I said, I have a 22-year old working at 7-11 because HS did not prepare him for the work college was going to take. As soon as he found out his grades were based on his actual work, he bailed. Now he's a struggling 22 year old trying to figure out why the world didn't offer him a $75K/year job just for being cute.

I had a similar issue in my 20s. Just encourage him to go back in a few years, after lower-class life kicks his ass for a few years.
I went back to school around 30 and started my actual career, once I realized how hard it is without.

It took me a few extra years, because I had a sweet poker-dealing gig for a while.

Not a good narrative to hold out in support of the public education system.

I'm no great fan of the current system - it's subpar, indeed. But I can't see wiping out the DoE as a solution.. In fact, I'm not entirely sure why people think that the existence of the Dept. is a bad thing. Is education subjective now?

You either think well, or you don't.. Hopefully the education is enough to stimulate that, and make up for poor parenting, while serving as job accreditation. That's really all that's needed.

[Okeefenokee]

I've been to some bad schools, in Atlanta for instance, but mostly I've been in really good schools with plenty of funding and competent teachers, etc. The whole nine yards.

The students have their share of responsibility in this. You can beat on teachers all you like, very few people can make kids, especially the smartphone generation, give a shit about school. Very very few kids would be in school if it was their choice to make. We get them to cooperate with threats of punishment and promises of wealth in the future. They aren't there because they want to learn, so why is it so shocking that they aren't learning?

How can you make them want to learn? For the most part, you can't. The human race is not one monolithic block of mental mathing book worms. Some people would rather talk about or play sports. Some people would rather talk about, watch, or take part in human drama. Some people would rather play video games.

I suppose you could invent some new schools. Besides the academic school you'd have the sports school, the drama school, the video game school, etc, and all day the students would only study and take part in the things they're interested in. I mean, we're already giving out useless degrees. Let's take it a step further.

[apeman]

[quote="GrumpyCatFace" Is education subjective now? [/quote]

oof