GWOT: The More Things Change . . .

[Smitty-48]

Qassim Al-Rimi being the target is news to me, maybe I missed that part, thought they were just going after intel. Seems reckless to send in SEAL team 6 for some computers, makes sense they would be going after a target

You have to fight for information, the enemy is not going to give it to you, and not everything can be gleaned by sattelites or other technical means, the enemy knows about all that, and so keeps his cards close to the vest.

Their phones and computers could have the most critical information of all, you never know until you have them in hand. Sensitive site exploitation to interdict the enemy network, that's how JSOC operates.

[Smitty-48]

See, this is a classic JSOC operation, same as they operated against the Zarqawi network in Iraq, you hit a target, you exploit the site for information about other targets, then you hit those targets, wash rinse repeat, but the difference here is; no boots on the ground.

In Iraq, you had the conventional forces securing the battlespace and providing support, whereas without boots on the ground, if anything goes wrong, there's no back up, if the shit hits the fan, you can't get on the horn and call in the tanks, infantry, engineers, what have you, so there's no room for error.

[SuburbanFarmer]

The White House — which had declared the raid "a successful operation by all standards" — had no comment Monday. The Pentagon also declined to comment.

[/quote]

Dude that 5-year-old had to be stopped at all costs. We won the war that day.

[pineapplemike]

Well I hope that the intel they acquired was worthwhile, I'm a little concerned to read that the intel appears to be an afterthought and not the original target, but surely they could have been multitasking and going after both. A dead servicemen and a dead little girl are bigly prices to pay for cheap intel..

[SuburbanFarmer]

Well I hope that the intel they acquired was worthwhile, I'm a little concerned to read that the intel appears to be an afterthought and not the original target, but surely they could have been multitasking and going after both. A dead servicemen and a dead little girl are bigly prices to pay for cheap intel..

Not even a consideration in DC, I'm sure. Just keep those VC counts up, private.

[Smitty-48]

I don't put much stock in counterleadership operations myself, it's whack-a-mole in essence, but at the same time, that's what America voted for, and I don't see any realistic prospects of dissuading the populist "wisdom" of the zeitgiest at this juncture.

The tactical issue however, was that the objective was much more heavily defended than expected, at which point, you have to pull out a bigger hammer and employ blunt force to kick the door down, even just to be able to extract. Once you're on the ground and pinned down, simply running away is not an option, you have to advance, in order to suppress the enemy so that you have the space to retreat, otherwise you're just going to get routed.

[Smitty-48]

Everybody in SOCOM has a mission, except the Marines, the Army does land, the Navy does sea, the Air Force does air, but the Marines are really just a less well funded version of what the Navy does, Rumsfeld insisted on the Marines having their own SOF component, and now it is entrenched, but it never really had a mission, it's just a poor man's NAVSPECWAR, so what I would do, is change the mission of MARSOC, make them the Force Protection specialists, the SOCOM QRF which would be on stand-by to provide heavy support where necessary, make MARSOC the SOF heavy component, to provide JSOC with a "fire brigade" for when more mass and force is required, right now they are Navy MEALs, but Marine SEAL's is duplicative, instead of MEALs, I would make MARSSOC the Sarines.

[SuburbanFarmer]

I don't put much stock in counterleadership operations myself, it's whack-a-mole in essence, but at the same time, that's what America voted for, and I don't see any realistic prospects of dissuading the populist "wisdom" of the zeitgiest at this juncture.

The tactical issue however, was that the objective was much more heavily defended than expected, at which point, you have to pull out a bigger hammer and employ blunt force to kick the door down, even just to be able to extract. Once you're on the ground and pinned down, simply running away is not an option, you have to advance, in order to suppress the enemy so that you have the space to retreat, otherwise you're just going to get routed.

I'd love to know which box I could have checked to vote for 'not fucking off in the Middle East anymore'. I'm pretty sure that option was the LP clown, which I voted for, but...

[Smitty-48]

I think what you're seeing, is that in the wake of Neptune Spear, AQ is simply fortifiying their bases to respond the fast and light hit and run counterleadership model; fly in, kill-capture, fly out again. They're trying to make it tough to take them down quick and dirty. The reason is probably that they are not confident that they can hide so easily, after Neptune Spear, the prospect of JSOC appearing out of nowhere in helicopters is front of mind, so now they dig in and reinforce to try to meet that threat, defensive works, minefields, snipers in overwatch, etcetera.