How's that Obamacare Repeal Working Out For You?

[SuburbanFarmer]

It'll be interesting to see what people do when their children die from not being able to afford readily accessible medications.

Sadly, honestly, I think they'll do nothing. Hospitals are amazing tools for hiding human suffering and death away from the rest of the population. Everybody in them feels isolated and alone, and assumes that they're the only ones in that situation.

If we all saw the full breadth of human suffering on a daily basis, and understood how cheap our lives really are, we'd have a single-payer system tomorrow. Hey, what's on Modern Family this week?

[adwinistrator]

It'll be interesting to see what people do when their children die from not being able to afford readily accessible medications.

You just need to change your outlook on life

Freedom and liberty: You don't have to pay more to cover the sickest Americans. When you or someone in your family dies from being unable to afford medical care, you take solace in the lower taxes and insurance rates of your neighbors.

Violence: The social contract, safety net, and the taxes that pay for it.

[Zlaxer]

It'll be interesting to see what people do when their children die from not being able to afford medications.

I'll be interested to see what people do when they're forced to stand hours in line to receive their government housing allowance, food stamps, etc., since they will be unable to pay for shit on their own after taxes go up to feed the beast.

You want the government to provide all of the life basics to everyone - there is simply not enough money to do so unless you start confiscating - which the government arguably already is doing with effective tax rates approaching 70% of total income.

[Zlaxer]

It'll be interesting to see what people do when their children die from not being able to afford readily accessible medications.

You just need to change your outlook on life

Freedom and liberty: You don't have to pay more to cover the sickest Americans. When you or someone in your family dies from being unable to afford medical care, you take solace in the lower taxes and insurance rates of your neighbors.

Violence: The social contract, safety net, and the taxes that pay for it.

Lolz - where are you getting your numbers from? There isnt' the money....

[Speaker to Animals]

ugh... no.

StA proposed that 'if you can't afford insurance, then just join Medicare'. Which nobody can do unless 65 years old, or in need of kidneys.

I said "You meant Medicaid, right"? And he proceeded to call me a dumbass for some reason, and continue being an idiot. Stupid poo-poo face.

Yep. You are on drugs at work.

I proposed our next health insurance reform include a Medicare for all to pick up what private insurance cannot without losing money sans government interventions.

Sooooo Medicaid, but not "Medicaid" because we totally renamed it to something else? Also, we can call it a "Medicare" but not that, because we're changing the rules and it's like that, but not for old people now cause REPUBLICANS.

Medicare. The same thing the members of Congress get.

You are a huge douche.

[jediuser598]

It'll be interesting to see what people do when their children die from not being able to afford readily accessible medications.

You just need to change your outlook on life

Freedom and liberty: You don't have to pay more to cover the sickest Americans. When you or someone in your family dies from being unable to afford medical care, you take solace in the lower taxes and insurance rates of your neighbors.

Violence: The social contract, safety net, and the taxes that pay for it.

Lolz - where are you getting your numbers from? There isnt' the money....

Wonder what the CBO will say about this new bill, if we can afford it. Unless I'm wrong, there are quite a few tax cuts. I guess we're not batting an eye at republican expenditures, 26 million already on golfing, but as soon as we talk about getting people healthcare it's "Oh gods, we can't do that! The socialism is running rampant!" Well sir, I don't want to pay for Trump's weekend trips to Maralago which his family personally benefits from, actually it seems he's not at maralago this weekend, he's at bedminster. Ah, that's right, instead of paying for 4k Medicaid recipients (https://www.istrumpatbedminster.org/) we should pay for that. Conservative priorities.

In comparison, Obama spent 97 million in 8 years. (http://www.cnn.com/2017/04/10/politics/ ... vel-costs/)

[Zlaxer]

You just need to change your outlook on life

Freedom and liberty: You don't have to pay more to cover the sickest Americans. When you or someone in your family dies from being unable to afford medical care, you take solace in the lower taxes and insurance rates of your neighbors.

Violence: The social contract, safety net, and the taxes that pay for it.

Lolz - where are you getting your numbers from? There isnt' the money....

Wonder what the CBO will say about this new bill, if we can afford it. Unless I'm wrong, there are quite a few tax cuts. I guess we're not batting an eye at republican expenditures, 26 million already, but as soon as we talk about getting people healthcare it's "Oh gods, we can't do that! The socialism is running rampant!" Well sir, I don't want to pay for Trump's weekend trips to Maralago which his family personally benefits from, actually it seems he's not at maralago, he's at bedminster. Ah, that's right, instead of paying for 4k Medicaid recipients (https://www.istrumpatbedminster.org/) we should pay for that. Conservative priorities.

In comparison, Obama spent 97 million in 8 years.

Why do you think I approve of the current bill? Apparently in Jediand, a smaller government = approval of the GOP.

[Speaker to Animals]

The problem is this: private insurance is a business. Lots of people are not profitable to insure. All of these schemes we have seen involved trying to make it profitable for private insurers to offer insurance to the otherwise uninsurable by taking more money from Americans who do qualify for insurance. Unfortunately, the nature of that particular business, and the rising costs imposed by an increasingly centralizing health provider industry, ensure people who do qualify for insurance are paying enormous premiums to keep this thing afloat. The premiums are going to get so high that people will just opt out because they can't realistically afford it.

All of the costs are being sloughed off onto just the middle class. The rich don't pay for this shit. The poor don't pay for this shit, even though they consume it, nor realistically can they pay those premiums.

On top of that, it's still not enough to keep the market afloat with these bennies mandated by law. So we have to subsidize these plans in addition to drastically increasing premiums of healthy people. The subsidies are coming from income taxes. Though, yes, the rich pay a higher total amount of taxes than the middle class, the middle class pays a much higher percentage of their income to these taxes. So high that they are struggling to get by in many cases, especially when you factor in property and other state taxation schemes.


On my Facebook feed, I am seeing liberal women shed crocodile tears because this new proposal would not force private insurers to accept pregnant women. So the fuck what!? Forcing them to accept a pregnant woman is like forcing them to just pay for the pregnancy and delivery without anything in return. These women will sign up, get their pre-natal and delivery paid for, and then go off the plan. How in the world does that make any sense?

The only reasonable and *practical* way to deal with this in our particular nation is to just expand Medicare so that people who cannot get insurance or afford it can simply enroll and get the basic necessities met, coupled with comprehensive coverage for major illness and injury. If you can afford and get private insurance with all its bells and whistles, then great! If not, you still get to live. You still get to deliver your baby in a hospital.

Everybody funds it through payroll taxes (who works). Is it fair that people who don't work get insurance and don't pay for it? Maybe in some cases. But the alternative is worse. All the alternatives are worse given the nature of our country.

[Okeefenokee]

Okee, you have kids. You have a bit more exposure to the damage that this is going to cause. One day (god forbid) you might end up in a place where all your savings are gone and your kid's life is on the line, if that ever happens it will put all of this in a much different perspective. You tell me what you wouldn't do to protect your family.

When a pharmacy is telling you that they're not going to give you that readily available medication, because you can't afford it, and because Government healthcare no longer covers it, and you're out of money to pay for it, things are going to get real. That's what a lot of people are facing. Is Obamacare a good thing? No, but it's better than what we had before.

I have to make money for everything. I have to pay for the house, and the clothes, and the food, and the cars. I don't put healthcare or medication in a different category. It's all just shit you need to live, and when the time comes that you need it, you have to pay for it.

[K@th]

I have to make money for everything. I have to pay for the house, and the clothes, and the food, and the cars. I don't put healthcare or medication in a different category. It's all just shit you need to live, and when the time comes that you need it, you have to pay for it.

That literally takes life down to a luck-based lottery.

A poor person can get by with minimal housing, can only consume a certain amount of food, only needs so much clothing.... but, one person may need $400K in medical care and another may never need any. It's the only commodity where the needs (not wants) are so vastly different.

I get you don't want to pay for your neighbor's cancer treatment and you don't want anyone to pay for yours. Should you get to a place where you have a loved one who needs every available resource you have, plus tens of thousands more beyond that, will you take comfort that you never had to give a penny so someone else could get that care?

Realistically, how do you see that playing out? Are you comfy that people will literally have to sit and watch as their loved ones die in agony because they couldn't afford chemo or drugs?

This is a very tough issue, and, at the risk of repeating myself, the answer isn't black & white.

Also, to everyone, please quit conflating health insurance with health care. Americans don't need health insurance; they need health care. Insurers need us to need insurance.

That said, I don't trust the government to fix this. Everything they touch turns to poop. There's got to be some sort of solution. I don't trust the free market on this - an epi pen that went from a few dollars to a few thousand dollars overnight is proof that the free market will not help control health care costs.

So, what's the answer?