Coronavirus thread

[The Conservative]

I mean, TC is actually borderline retarded and I made a resolution to try not to punch down.

To the rest of you who should have known better.. It is my suspicion that most of you think nothing much will come of the disease if we just went straight back to business as usual, and that this belief is not based on evidence or any accurate math at all, but instead is an ideological belief. You prioritize markets and economy, which normally is a worthwhile position to take, but right now not so much. The problem for you (and potentially for hundreds of thousands of Americans) is that the evidence we have indicates you are a very wrong.

There are ways of loosening up the restrictions, but they involve widespread testing in a time when the Trump administration is trying to seize tests from states and stop the testing outside a narrow definition of who is eligible. We need to all wear masks in public to stop the spread of the disease in a society where probably at least a quarter of the population thinks the disease is a hoax and refuses to wear masks.

It kind of seems like you guys are going to get a lot of people needlessly killed. Then sometime next Winter, when the rest of us are pissed at you for doing it, you will refuse to accept blame for it. So why should anybody negotiate with you on this? I kind of see the point of those democrat governors fucking with you like they do. There is no way to negotiate with this ideological position.

COVID-19 (MA).png

All my data can be found here:

1. COVID-19 INFO

2. COVID-19 Mass Raw Data

3. Mass Population

Also my other statements about states like Mass adding excess deaths to the COVID-19 deathtoll, and how the CDC corrected it.

Provisional COVID-19 Death Counts by Week Ending Date and State

Excess Deaths Associated with COVID-19 - Raw Data

Now, put up or shut up.

[Speaker to Animals]

Those charts are not very useful. Check out the main site:

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/


It is still exponential worldwide. Parts of the US are still in exponential growth.

NYT has good data visualization lately too.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/202 ... cases.html
That one actually shows you where mitigation efforts are working and where we are still seeing exponential growth in the US.


The main caveat here is this: Trump still controls access to testing. So the total test count is bullshit. You really have to just look at the deaths to get an idea of what is going down. Only the sickest can get tests. We have no idea what is actually going on in this country in terms of the disease's spread, and that's mostly Trump's fault, though it's being carried out by the CDC and the FDC on his behalf. Some states have smuggled tests into the country and hiding them from the federal government so that they are not stolen. It is unclear what will happen when they attempt widespread community testing. I think he will try to confiscate the tests, but who knows, really.

Reposted because the links to accurate data are worth not getting buried by bullshit.

[The Conservative]

Those charts are not very useful. Check out the main site:

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/


It is still exponential worldwide. Parts of the US are still in exponential growth.

NYT has good data visualization lately too.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/202 ... cases.html
That one actually shows you where mitigation efforts are working and where we are still seeing exponential growth in the US.


The main caveat here is this: Trump still controls access to testing. So the total test count is bullshit. You really have to just look at the deaths to get an idea of what is going down. Only the sickest can get tests. We have no idea what is actually going on in this country in terms of the disease's spread, and that's mostly Trump's fault, though it's being carried out by the CDC and the FDC on his behalf. Some states have smuggled tests into the country and hiding them from the federal government so that they are not stolen. It is unclear what will happen when they attempt widespread community testing. I think he will try to confiscate the tests, but who knows, really.

Reposted because the links to accurate data are worth not getting buried by bullshit.

So in English, I'll believe the NY Times and a third party site, than actual sources... fuck off with your twattery.

[DBTrek]

‘All night, my eyes are open’: After mass job losses, Americans forced to choose: Pay bills or buy food?

...The financial crisis comes at a precarious moment for households already teetering on the brink of ruin. Even before the pandemic struck, nearly a third of Americans didn't have a savings account. Average credit card debt per household topped $7,000 and personal loans were the fastest-growing type of consumer debt in 2019. More than 20% of all children lived in families with incomes below the federal poverty level. ...

https://www.usatoday.com/in-depth/news/ ... 020833001/

More woes those who never have to worry about income will never have to experience.

[Speaker to Animals]

Here is the problem just from the perspective of one state (Maryland).

Key background

The Trump administration has put the onus on states to obtain medical supplies and expand testing themselves, with the federal government acting as a “supplier of last resort.” It has not been easy. Massachusetts ordered 3 million masks that were confiscated by the federal government at the Port of New York, forcing them to lean on New England Patriots’ owner Robert Kraft to use his team plane to fly in 1 million N95 masks from China. Hospitals in states like California and Florida reported that the Federal Emergency Management Agency had seized their supplies without explanation.


Chief critic

President Donald Trump criticized the governor for going through a foreign state to obtain the tests: "I don't think he needed to go to South Korea. I think he needed to get a little knowledge.” Hogan said he didn’t have a choice. "The president said the governors are on their own and they should really focus on getting their own tests, and that's exactly what we did,” he said on MSNBC.

Big number

21,742. That is how many cases of COVID-19 have been reported in Maryland, though that number is likely to rise once testing becomes more widely available.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/arielshapi ... decfa975d3


There is no way to know how many people were infected because the Trump administration controls the tests. He blames governors for lack of testing but, if they purchase tests overseas, he confiscates them anyway. The CDC wants to control all the test kits and they refuse to make enough of them for community testing to happen. The FDC refuses to approve third party tests that states can use in clinical settings.

You cannot reopen the economy in these conditions without risking mass fatalities. We simply do not know what is going on and we won't even know where it is picking up until the ICU is flooded. Then it is too late.

If you want to reopen the economy, it seems to me that you should direct your ire towards Trump himself. This is intolerable. Why would he steal test kits from states and then blame the governors for not having test kits??

[The Conservative]

‘All night, my eyes are open’: After mass job losses, Americans forced to choose: Pay bills or buy food?

...The financial crisis comes at a precarious moment for households already teetering on the brink of ruin. Even before the pandemic struck, nearly a third of Americans didn't have a savings account. Average credit card debt per household topped $7,000 and personal loans were the fastest-growing type of consumer debt in 2019. More than 20% of all children lived in families with incomes below the federal poverty level. ...

https://www.usatoday.com/in-depth/news/ ... 020833001/

More woes those who never have to worry about income will never have to experience.

I'd love to see someone speak in front of congress and lambaste them for their stupidity.

[DBTrek]

So anyway... if you never have to worry about a mortgage or rent payment, and you never have to worry about food, and you can literally sit on your ass all day and still have all your needs met . . . then it's pretty easy to cast stones at folks who can't.

It's like the poor man's version of "Let them eat cake".
The rich, and the government wards can all relax, knowing "they've got theirs" regardless ... and criticize all the people whose existence is not secure for making decisions they wouldn't. Condescension is always easier than empathy, and . .. let's face it, neither the rich nor the government supported are particularly lauded for their ability to empathize with anyone else.

It is what it is - but remember who you're dealing with, and their limitations, when considering how seriously to take them.

[Speaker to Animals]

Nobody is casting stones at you for losing your jobs. You are the one casting stones at me for losing my job because I became permanently disabled (which really says you are total piece of shit, btw). That's some epic gaslighting.

Meanwhile, rational people can discuss how to mitigate the economic fallout of the disease. Sending everybody back to work right now will probably wreck the economy anyway. So it's not like you have a good case here at all, even without the bigoted gaslighting.

The economy is fucked no matter what we do, so that shit is a completely different discussion about how we are supposed to rebuild after this is over. You are just acting like a child throwing a tantrum because we can't just go back to pre-covid lifestyle. News flash: that world is likely gone forever. No amount of gaslighting and tantrum throwing is going to put the virus back in the box.

[pineapplemike]

i want free money

[Montegriffo]

Yeah, because everybody else loves being unemployed. It's only conservatives that like great depression living.


Perhaps consider that your ideas of reopening the economy with fuck all mitigation efforts in place is going to make the economy worse in the long run. I mean LMFAO. For once, be honest about what others are arguing. This time it is kind of serious.

I never floated any "reopen the economy with no safety measures" idea.
And even if I did, it wouldn't really affect you, would it?

You're not out there.
You're at home, waiting for that check that covers your expenses.
That check that's coming no matter what, so it affords you all sorts of room to cast stones at those who don't have the same luxury.

And I'm not begrudging you your situation, you served country and apparently became injured in the process. But you may want to consider that everyone doesn't have it so easy. Instead of assuming those who don't agree with you are a bunch of devil-goblins and caricatures why not realize you live a pretty charmed existence? Why not admit that you don't have to worry about your rent getting paid, or getting money for food next week. Ever. All that is just handed to you.

But a lot of those angry people you're lampooning - they don't get that.
They're looking at risking a low fatality virus, or losing their homes and having no food.
There making choices you'll never have to.

That's a bullshit argument.
I'm not in StA's position, I'm getting no government assistance, am out of money and my trade is one of the worst hit yet I'm not in a rush to open up. Certain conditions need to be met first. The rate of infection needs to be low enough, the health service needs to be in a position where it is not in danger of being overwhelmed, PPE needs to be widely available and the reason for it's use needs to be understood. Most of all there needs to be enough capacity to test, track and contain any new outbreaks of the disease.
We are not there yet.