Daniel Shaver shooting

[heydaralon]

Clearly, the only options are between "police state" and "anarchy". One cannot expect to maintain a domestic police force without murdering and abusing the citizenry.

You get it, Im just worried that Fife doesnt. If the police hadnt shot that unarmed man, a criminal in our lawless society would have. And you dont want that do you?

[SuburbanFarmer]

Clearly, the only options are between "police state" and "anarchy". One cannot expect to maintain a domestic police force without murdering and abusing the citizenry.

You get it, Im just worried that Fife doesnt. If the police hadnt shot that unarmed man, a criminal in our lawless society would have. And you dont want that do you?

Well, that would involve significant legal processing fees...

[heydaralon]

Also got pulled over once at 18 yo, was told multiple times that he “smelled weed”, and had my car searched. There wasn’t any, and I’d never smoked anything but cigarettes in that car.

Maybe they’ve always been like this, I don’t know. It’s disgusting.

Can you imagine if an 18 was smoking weed? Do I need to remind you that it is a controlled substance and illegal? If teenagers and young adults were smoking weed without the police putting a stop to it, we would have catastrophic problems in pur society. A complete collapse is not out of the question. That cop put his life on the line searching your car and all he asks in return is a generous salary and pension plus immunity for all of his civil rights violations. Not a bad deal imo.

[LVH2]

If you're concerned about your safety, and you happen to point a rifle or what would appears to be one, out of a hotel window, I'd advise you to get out ahead of that, go down to the lobby, tell them that you just did something very reckless and foolish, and the police are probably going to be showing up any moment now, jacked up for a mad sniper call, so you're just going to wait with the staff of the hotel, so you can turn yourself in when they arrive. I wouldn't, if I were you, just run around the hallways of the hotel, after pulling a stunt like that.

Again, I don't know what it's like in Arizona, but If I did that here, no doubt an army of cops would show up, and no doubt they would be jacked up.

Good advice.

But there are tons of people who are stupid, drunk, high, crazy, stressed out or who panic or break down in high pressure situations. We can say, "you shouldn't be like that," but they are like that anyway.

If police training/policy results in several hundred such people being shot every year, it needs to change. Cops will just have to grow a pair and find the courage that everybody other than them has. I think most of them already have it. Can the rest.

[heydaralon]

[*]lAR 15s are quit ineffective in a case like Shavers. The elastic in his underwear might have caused the bullet to ricochet off and hit one of the 7 cops who were standing in that hallway. His false crying was an elaborate code to alert the ISIS attackers hidden inside the walls to open fire on the cops, and his crawling and slobbering on the floor was actually a sophisticated Krav Maga manuever that would have easily disarmed the 7 cops and resulted in a brutal police hostage situation. I want to take the time to commend the officer for his restraint in this tense situation. He was in a tough spot, and the suspect was being quite belligerent and noncompliant. There was simply not a way to resolve this situation any other way. My only critique was that the officer did not use lethal force against the female guest they took into custody, as she was clearly the ringleader in this sleeper cell op and probably went on to plan devastating attacks on American soil. For that reason, Im glad the officer was fired. He had two dangerous targets to eliminate, and he failed the American public by refusing to do so. Hes still a fine young man, and courageous soul, but not police material.

[LVH2]

[*]lAR 15s are quit ineffective in a case like Shavers. The elastic in his underwear might have caused the bullet to ricochet off and hit one of the 7 cops who were standing in that hallway. His false crying was an elaborate code to alert the ISIS attackers hidden inside the walls to open fire on the cops, and his crawling and slobbering on the floor was actually a sophisticated Krav Maga manuever that would have easily disarmed the 7 cops and resulted in a brutal police hostage situation. I want to take the time to commend the officer for his restraint in this tense situation. He was in a tough spot, and the suspect was being quite belligerent and noncompliant. There was simply not a way to resolve this situation any other way. My only critique was that the officer did not use lethal force against the female guest they took into custody, as she was clearly the ringleader in this sleeper cell op and probably went on to plan devastating attacks on American soil. For that reason, Im glad the officer was fired. He had two dangerous targets to eliminate, and he failed the American public by refusing to do so. Hes still a fine young man, and courageous soul, but not police material.

[Smitty-48]

If you're concerned about your safety, and you happen to point a rifle or what would appears to be one, out of a hotel window, I'd advise you to get out ahead of that, go down to the lobby, tell them that you just did something very reckless and foolish, and the police are probably going to be showing up any moment now, jacked up for a mad sniper call, so you're just going to wait with the staff of the hotel, so you can turn yourself in when they arrive. I wouldn't, if I were you, just run around the hallways of the hotel, after pulling a stunt like that.

Again, I don't know what it's like in Arizona, but If I did that here, no doubt an army of cops would show up, and no doubt they would be jacked up.

Good advice.

But there are tons of people who are stupid, drunk, high, crazy, stressed out or who panic or break down in high pressure situations. We can say, "you shouldn't be like that," but they are like that anyway.

If police training/policy results in several hundred such people being shot every year, it needs to change. Cops will just have to grow a pair and find the courage that everybody other than them has. I think most of them already have it. Can the rest.

Well, I think the nation itself would have to find more collective courage, as in assuming more risk at the legislative and regulatory level, because the police are really just instruments, which are subject to the environment, so I don't see how America itself can be on permanent hysterical hair trigger alert, all day every day, permeating every aspect of life, but somehow the police would be the only people in America who are calm cool and collected in everything that they do.

If you want to ratchet the pressure down at the tactical level, you need to ratchet it down at the strategic level first,

[Smitty-48]

Bear in mind, for every civil libertarian calling for the police to be restrained, there's a thousand people screeching at them to
"DO SOMETHING! NAAAOOOW!"

It's like the guy who got choked to death for selling cigarettes, who called that in on him? The cops? No, the local store owners, and they wanted him stopped and stopped now, and then we he resisted, the fur started to fly, which it inevitably will.

There's no point in telling the cops to live and let live, when the people they report to are not willing to follow that rule.

[Ph64]

Bear in mind, for every civil libertarian calling for the police to be restrained, there's a thousand people screeching at them to
"DO SOMETHING! NAAAOOOW!"

It's like the guy who got choked to death for selling cigarettes, who called that in on him? The cops? No, the local store owners, and they wanted him stopped and stopped now, and then we he resisted, the fur started to fly, which it inevitably will.

Once the cops start getting military surplus MOABs it'll be no problem, crime will drop dramatically after a half dozen inner city areas get taken out. The masses will cheer at the dramatic fall in crime/murder rates.

[Smitty-48]

The Temperance Lady is a harsh mistress, who knew?