LET'S BAN GUNS!

[Ex-California]

So what do you make the point with? These people think that liberty is a joke and don't have a problem with regulating away people's rights if they think those rights are dangerous. They also think that using arms as a way to stand up to tyranny is a joke because what's one person, even with a big bad "assault rifle" going to do to stand up to the full might of the State War Machine?

You bring up how the 4A has effectively been regulated away, and that just feeds their bullshit that no right in the Bill of Rights is absolute. The SCOTUS has even confirmed this.

Judging by the talk everywhere but here in the last few days, I believe we have a long road ahead of us

[de officiis]

http://thehill.com/opinion/criminal-jus ... merica?amp

[Hanarchy Montanarchy]

So what do you make the point with? These people think that liberty is a joke and don't have a problem with regulating away people's rights if they think those rights are dangerous. They also think that using arms as a way to stand up to tyranny is a joke because what's one person, even with a big bad "assault rifle" going to do to stand up to the full might of the State War Machine?

You bring up how the 4A has effectively been regulated away, and that just feeds their bullshit that no right in the Bill of Rights is absolute. The SCOTUS has even confirmed this.

Judging by the talk everywhere but here in the last few days, I believe we have a long road ahead of us

I think bringing up the 4th is an effective way to describe the legal creep that slowly strangles a right.

If you are talking to someone who is genuinely equivocal on liberty as a value, then you aren't going to convince them on gun rights, you should try to convince them of the importance of liberty to a free society. If you can't convince an American of that, either they are unreachable or you are a terrible debater.

I hate to say it, but using the the 2nd to resist domestic tyranny is a joke. If it has gotten to that point, your constitutional protections are pretty much meaningless anyway. There lies the path to claiming yourself a 'sovereign citizen,' or some other such bull shit. I wouldn't recommend arguing that line either.

The best defense of gun rights is very simple, and it rests in the superiority of constitutional government, and a state with well defined, enumerated powers. If you move away from that clear line, you are straw manning yourself and doing the majority of your opponents work for them.

All this, but, but, what about this way you can die, or that way you can die, something, something, low-info, I need to defend myself from the gub'ment talk is often nonsensical or fallacious, and rests on feelz as surely as your Kimmels do.

[Ex-California]

The 4A creep somewhat works on the smarter ones, and it especially works when they start bringing up the argument, "well when is the right time to have a conversation about gun rights?" You simply mention everything that happened in the 6 months after 911.

I've most been telling them that if they really, really want guns to be regulated/suppressed in the way they want, that they have to go all the way and repeal the 2A and replace it with statutes. The loud ones are against this because they know that this is too tough, the smarter ones get this when put through the lens of losing other BofR rights through regulation creep.

This is still a long battle ahead

[Hanarchy Montanarchy]

Well, no one ever promised that liberty, self government, and being a responsible citizen of a free society was going to be easy.

[Ex-California]

These people just want it to be easy. Let the state babysit them

[de officiis]

Well, no one ever promised that liberty, self government, and being a responsible citizen of a free society was going to be easy.

Amen.

[K@th]

Yeah, under the Kath totalitarian doctrine,

You didn't even read what I wrote. Go back, re-read and see if you can find me saying the mentally ill shouldn't have guns. I'll wait.

[The Conservative]

Is an AR15 really high-powered?

What does that word even mean to people like Monty? It seems to be included as a synonym for scary.

In the grand scheme of things, an AR-15 is low on the rifle scale of power, that is unless you dick around with the grams of powder in the bullet... then that's another story altogether.

[The Conservative]

I still say that guns aren't the issue... it's people, which of course most people in Congress refuse to admit.