Russia! Russia!! Russia!!!

[Smitty-48]

I reject the notion that the FBI has any jurisdiction over "collusion" as it pertains to digging up dirt on your opponents in an election, if an American politician is want to use dirt on their opponents, even if gleaned from some foreign source, to include intelligence agencies, it's none of the FBI's business, it's not a crime to dig up dirt on your poltical opponents to win an election, it's constitutionally protected speech, the electorate will decide whether or not it is appropriate, not the FBI.

Using material that is out there is one thing, meeting with Russian officials is another as there obviously was an ongoing Russian operation. Bound to have the FBI looking up on it.

From the FBI's website:

Our Mission

To protect the American people and uphold the Constitution of the United States.


Our Priorities

Protect the United States from terrorist attack
Protect the United States against foreign intelligence operations and espionage
Protect the United States against cyber-based attacks and high-technology crimes
Combat public corruption at all levels
Protect civil rights
Combat transnational/national criminal organizations and enterprises
Combat major white-collar crime
Combat significant violent crime

Too bad they (the FBI) have on their agenda "protecting the US against foreign intelligence operations". But they do have it.

To protect and uphold the constitution begins with the First Amendment, which secures the liberty to talk to whomever you please, to include Russians of any stripe, and use any dirt on your political opponents gleaned from talking to whomever you please, to include Russians of any stripe, as you please, it's none of the FBI's business.

Even if the dirt on your poltical opponents was obtained by some sort of intelligence operation; you have no duty nor legal obligation to your poltical opponents to protect their dirty laundry, regardless of where you find it. If the FSB stole it from them and then gives it to you, that's no crime commited by you, you can get your dirt from anywhere, it's constitutionally protected speech, the Democratic National Commitee has no special protections from having their dirty laundry aired in public, quite the opposite in fact.

If the FBI wants to charge some FSB agent with espionage, go right ahead, but when the FBI tries to investigate an American for exercising their First Amendment right, then the FBI are the criminals at that point.

[ssu]

To protect and uphold the constitution begins with the First Amendment, which secures the liberty to talk to whomever you please, to include Russians of any stripe, and use any dirt on your political opponents gleaned from talking to whomever you please, to include Russians of any stripe, as you please, it's none of the FBI's business.

Even if the dirt on your poltical opponents was obtained by some sort of intelligence operation; you have no duty nor legal obligation to your poltical opponents to protect their dirty laundry, regardless of where you find it.

If the FBI wants to charge some FSB agent with espionage, go right ahead, but when the FBI tries to investigate an American for exercising their First Amendment right, then the FBI are the criminals at that point.

I think they aren't investigating Americans for exercising their freedom of speech, but meeting with Russian operatives.

That's what the FBI does. That's what any goddam counter-espionage organization does.

It's up to the justice system, not the FBI, to decide if someone will be charged or not.

[Smitty-48]

To protect and uphold the constitution begins with the First Amendment, which secures the liberty to talk to whomever you please, to include Russians of any stripe, and use any dirt on your political opponents gleaned from talking to whomever you please, to include Russians of any stripe, as you please, it's none of the FBI's business.

Even if the dirt on your poltical opponents was obtained by some sort of intelligence operation; you have no duty nor legal obligation to your poltical opponents to protect their dirty laundry, regardless of where you find it.

If the FBI wants to charge some FSB agent with espionage, go right ahead, but when the FBI tries to investigate an American for exercising their First Amendment right, then the FBI are the criminals at that point.

I think they aren't investigating Americans for exercising their freedom of speech, but meeting with Russian operatives.

That's what the FBI does. That's what any goddam counter-espionage organization does.

It's up to the justice system, not the FBI, to decide if someone will be charged or not.

I simply find that to be specious nonsense, the realpoltik, from where I'm sitting, is that the FBI is engaged in political interference by spurious witchhunt on behalf of connected entrenched interests in Washington in contravention of the will of the American electorate, and as such, If I was an American, I would back Trump to the hilt, against an FBI which behaves like the very KGB which they claim to be protecting the American people from.

If you even buy, never mind propagate the assertion, that the FBI is a politically agnostic disinterested party which is just doing their jobs here, I'd say you're either being disengenous, or you're just a total moron.

Even if I find most of what Trump says and does to be populist balderdash, the fact that the secret political police of America are so clearly going after him without due cause on behalf of corrupt entrenched interests in Washington, is the very essence of his appeal.

Who would ever trust anything the FBI says? They have been caught engaging in constitutional crimes, systemically and habitually, since the founding of their organization, constitutionally speaking, the FBI is organized crime, and always has been, that's really what the "goddamn" FBI does, and anybody who hasn't figured that out by now, is not someone whose judgement is to be trusted.

So which is it, ssu? Are you just full of shit, or are you just a fool?

You really think these dicksucking liberals trust the FBI? Not when it's coming after them, amirite? No, they're only totalitarian as it pertains to their ideological opponents, when the FBI shoe is on the other foot, up their flabby asses, they scream bloody murder, who knew?

I do see a silver lining here of course, because I think that the unrestrained political weaponization of the state secruity forces, will backfire upon the Left a thousand fold, and it will warm the cockles of my coal black heart, when they and their pampered panty waist bourgeois spawn, find themselves deep sixed into an extrajudicial blackhole by the FBI & Co, for political crimes against the Right; just desserts.

Hold your children tight, Lefties, the FBI & Co unleashed, will be coming for them next, don't kid yourselves, and don't come crying when you let Mr. Pinochet out of his cage to get Donald Trump for you, and he then inevitably runs amok and chucks your precious babies out of a helicopter after, heheheheh...

"Oh, well, we're very sorry Mr and Mrs Liberal America, but we found your children to be talking to the wrong people overseas, what you call 'social justice activists', we have determined to be a terrorist organization conducting operations against the United States, so we'll be holding little Sunray and Moonchild for a bit longer, probably about 40 years; 'talking to hostile foreign agents' for the purposes of 'undermining and interfering with the democratic process', you see, that's a very serious crime in America now, you know, since we de facto suspended the First Amendment on order to get Donald Trump...whoa, I wouldn't try make any trouble for us here at the FBI, wouldn't want anything to happen to Sunray and Moonchild while they were in custody, yeah, that's right, take a lap, you dicksucking liberals, before your kids are found hanging in their cells from a bedsheet, don't fuck with us... now if you'll excuse us, we have important national security business to attend to, have a nice day."

[clubgop]

Be honest guys, Trump could have been giving Putin a big ol sloppy blowjob throughout his campaign, and you'd be like "oh well, changes nothing, I think blowjobs are awesome, Make America/Russia Great Again!"

Yadda, yadda, prove something, bitch. No could have or woulda.

It wouldn't matter if anyone proves anything, you fellas wouldn't give a damn.

That's modern politics these days, people don't have principles (with a few exceptions, respect to Smitty and DBtrek for dropping Trump after his 2nd amendment terror list thing) you have your politicians. Whatever they say is good, because they said so. How's the Republican stack doing again? Trump isn't family values when he brags about sleeping with other men's wives, he's not non-interventionist when he's sending missile strikes into Syria. What are your political principles exactly?

How about yours? When did you not stop giving head to Hillary?

[ssu]

I simply find that to be specious nonsense, the realpoltik, from where I'm sitting, is that the FBI is engaged in political interference by spurious witchhunt on behalf of connected entrenched interests in Washington in contravention of the will of the American electorate, and as such, If I was an American, I would back Trump to the hilt, against an FBI which behaves like the very KGB which they claim to be protecting the American people from.

Did the FBI behave as the very KGB when it was investigating Hillary Clinton and his e-mail mess? Weren't they on the GOP side back then? Totally political then to some... oh, but then it was the other side of the political divide holloring about foul play as people here now.

Even if I find most of what Trump says and does to be populist balderdash, the fact that the secret political police of America are so clearly going after him without due cause on behalf of corrupt entrenched interests in Washington, is the very essence of his appeal.

What fucking entrenched interests is Trump really going after? Tell me.

He can say whatever about renegotiating NAFTA, but in the end sure the hell won't be Trump in charge, just look how his brilliant replace-medicair thing went. We'll just hear from him that "Oh, NAFTA is actually more complicated than anybody could have imagined". Because his very essence of appeal is just what you said, populist balderdash, plain old populism in which he actually hasn't been so successfull in actually delivering on. Trump hasn't gotten anything done that the GOP doesn't want.

So I think it's delurious to think he's any kind of threat to the establishment. Goldman Sachs is already in his team, his security team is traditional old-school on US security & foreign policy.

Trump is no Ron Paul who really would be against the foreign policy establishment.

[ssu]

The idea that the FBI went after Trump because he is "a threat to the establishment" shows just the ignorance of how the intel community works.

Take the example of one puny sidekick here Carter Page. So Mr. Carter "Ukraine-is-an-artificial-country" Page is picked up by the FBI years earlier with Russian spies talking about the idiot as basically a "recruited asset". Mr. Page gives information about the energy sector to the Russians, but this isn't secret material and hence there is no crime. Then the guy shows up in the foreign-policy team of a presidential candidate and as on that foreign-policy team goes flying to Moscow and back.

What kind of intelligence professional would say "Nah, let's not keep taps on this guy" ? ? ?

What kind of person would halt the surveillance high up on the FBI command chain from basically having the counter-espionage people doing their normal work? Answer: Nobody. So no reason for the FBI not to get the FISA warrant to monitor Carter Page. The reason that it will continue on auto-pilot because the FBI has a goddam counter-espionage unit and the one goddam mission of the FBI is to "Protect the United States against foreign intelligence operations and espionage". And if Russia does have an ongoing intelligence operation on the election IRRELEVANT of what potential ties that has to Americans, the FBI will goddam look into it.

So stop with the idiotic rant that everything is a conspiracy against Trump, because earlier it was a conspiracy against Clinton by the same guys in the same department, which doesn't make any sense.

[TheReal_ND]

Fuck off shariablue

[TheReal_ND]

[de officiis]

Be honest guys, Trump could have been giving Putin a big ol sloppy blowjob throughout his campaign, and you'd be like "oh well, changes nothing, I think blowjobs are awesome, Make America/Russia Great Again!"

Yadda, yadda, prove something, bitch. No could have or woulda.

It wouldn't matter if anyone proves anything, you fellas wouldn't give a damn.

That's modern politics these days, people don't have principles (with a few exceptions, respect to Smitty and DBtrek for dropping Trump after his 2nd amendment terror list thing) you have your politicians. Whatever they say is good, because they said so. How's the Republican stack doing again? Trump isn't family values when he brags about sleeping with other men's wives, he's not non-interventionist when he's sending missile strikes into Syria. What are your political principles exactly?

Well, you're right to a degree. Principles are at risk for being inconvenient when your focus becomes hating your opposition and defining yourself as anti-other.

[Cid]

Straight up, for me, TL:DR

Can someone sum up the current rationalizations for the various globalist stances we've taken, the repeated lying about something that while not illegal would have gotten Clinton impeached so fast her catheter would spin, and the appointment of the various bankers plus the friendliness with the Fed?

Like I don't need all of that explained, but I figure a bunch of cucks that are happy to be buggered by team Red could work one or two out for me.