Congressman Steve Scalise (R) shot

[SuburbanFarmer]

Quite frankly, with the fiendishly accurate AR and five-five-six inside 100m, headshots are childsplay just over iron sights, the scope was probably more a burden than a boon with arcs at that range, and any sort of rapid fire was totally unecessary, single aimed shots with an AR inside 100, can't miss really, unless you're a complete and total neophyte that is. As to being shot at, I've been shot at on multiple occasions, and didn't actually have any adverse reaction to it, until some time after, so the whole pee your pants and can't shoot straight with the rounds snapping past you doesn't ring true to me, it's one thing to know you're about to die, but in the moment, unless its the forlorn hope, you don't actually think that, you're just thinking "hey, that was a bullet that just wizzed by, that's odd, I'll probably be upset about that, later..."

In real time, there's no fear, only adrenaline, but that is not difficult to manage, just because someone shoots at you, doens't mean you fold up into a ball, quite the opposite, things seem to slow down rather, the adrenaline actually heightens your perception it doesn't dull it. Adrenaline is not an impairment, it's more like a booster shot to the brain. The surge of adrenaline, it's like a flash of superpowers, you see better, you move faster, you think faster, everything is slowed down while you are sped up.

Very different scenario when you're not being surprise-attacked, and have time to think about it before hand. You know you'll be dead in a few minutes, so it's the equivalent of stepping off a cliff, when you take that first shot. I'm guessing the adrenaline was pretty overwhelming.

That video is surreal. Lots of people just kinda hanging out, instead of running. Apparently they think chain-link is bulletproof?

[C-Mag]

You don't hear two different sounds?

The deep reports, those are 7.62. AndI don't think it's an AKM (AK47), they have a little sharper report. Not a 308 either. So that leaves us with a SKS, SVT 40, Dragonov, all sound similar and then you have the Mini 30.

Compare Sig Sauer 226 9mm (DC capitol police standard issue)

Nah, I"m saying it's an SKS or Mini-30

[Alexander PhiAlipson]

War is operational deployment for the full spectrum of combat operations under Chapter 7 rules of engagement, that, I have never been called upon for, but I never said I haven't been shot at. As for master of arms, just a fact, there's no general platform I haven't mastered at this point, from sidearm to TOW missile, and I could plan and execute the full range of tactical missions, from section to company level, and nothing about Chapter 7 rules of engagement would particularly enhance my training, in fact, skills degrade on operational deployment, because most of the time you're not training, you barely even do PT.

Riiiiiight.
Get Smitty on the line--we need someone to pilot this fishing trawler into Vladivostok to take out that Russian carrier group. He's our only hope! Think his wife will let him do it?

[Smitty-48]

Very different scenario when you're not being surprise-attacked, and have time to think about it before hand. You know you'll be dead in a few minutes, so it's the equivalent of stepping off a cliff, when you take that first shot. I'm guessing the adrenaline was pretty overwhelming.

Meh, I don't think so, adrenaline doesn't overwhelm, it hits the blood, you feel the dump, but it's not like it just keeps coming and coming, after a couple seconds, you're just doing what you have to do, that might be run for your life, obviously if he has a gun and you don't, you're not really going to go flying superman punch, but if you are armed, it's not like you're going to go "ZOMG, I can't shoot him, this adrenaline is overwhelming", that's not how adrenaline works, it's not actually your enemy at all, it's much worse, after the fact, when the adrenal superpowers wear off, that's when you go into shock.

[SuburbanFarmer]

Very different scenario when you're not being surprise-attacked, and have time to think about it before hand. You know you'll be dead in a few minutes, so it's the equivalent of stepping off a cliff, when you take that first shot. I'm guessing the adrenaline was pretty overwhelming.

Meh, I don't think so, adrenaline doesn't overwhelm, it hits the blood, you feel the dump, but it's not like it just keeps coming and coming, after a couple seconds, you're just doing what you have to do, that might be run for your life, obviously if he has a gun and you don't, you're not really going to go flying superman punch, but if you are armed, it's not like you're going to go "ZOMG, I can't shoot him, this adrenaline is overwhelming", that's not how adrenaline works, it's not actually your enemy at all, it's much worse, after the fact, when the adrenal superpowers wear off, that's when you go into shock.

Yeah, but imagine the minutes after first contact too. You've shot a congressman and maybe a few other, now what? Run for it? Wait for death? Play hide and seek? What are you doing here? What happens now? What's it gonna feel like when you die?

Confusion, adrenaline, lack of planning, impending certain death... these are not conducive to good marksmanship. Plus, he didn't have a squad of buddies around, or even a clear objective. The world suddenly wanted him dead, and he would be soon.

It's becoming pretty common knowledge now, that the police no longer take prisoners if you're armed. Not even a warning in most cases.

[Smitty-48]

Very different scenario when you're not being surprise-attacked, and have time to think about it before hand. You know you'll be dead in a few minutes, so it's the equivalent of stepping off a cliff, when you take that first shot. I'm guessing the adrenaline was pretty overwhelming.

Meh, I don't think so, adrenaline doesn't overwhelm, it hits the blood, you feel the dump, but it's not like it just keeps coming and coming, after a couple seconds, you're just doing what you have to do, that might be run for your life, obviously if he has a gun and you don't, you're not really going to go flying superman punch, but if you are armed, it's not like you're going to go "ZOMG, I can't shoot him, this adrenaline is overwhelming", that's not how adrenaline works, it's not actually your enemy at all, it's much worse, after the fact, when the adrenal superpowers wear off, that's when you go into shock.

Yeah, but imagine the minutes after first contact too. You've shot a congressman and maybe a few other, now what? Run for it? Wait for death? Play hide and seek? What are you doing here? What happens now? What's it gonna feel like when you die?

Confusion, adrenaline, lack of planning, impending certain death... these are not conducive to good marksmanship.

Markmanship wouldn't be effected, markmanship is just muscle memory, it's not subject to concious thought, it's like a riding a bicycle, you don't think about what you're doing, you just ride, weapon comes up, front sight on the target, inhale-exhale halfway-fire, there's no thinking involved, in fact, you could be thinking about something else, while your body just shoots the targets on autopilot.

What confusion? You don't get to where he was by walking around confused, obviously he knew what he had come to do. And as for adrenaline, as I said, it doesn't impair you, it slows things down so you can shoot even better, the more adrenaline the better, it's only after the fact that you get the shakes or whatever, in the adrenal dump, you're instincts and muscle memory are even more intense, even less consiously at that point.

As for impending death, seemed a rather suicidal plan actually, suicide by cop is just getting someone else to do it for you, actually much easier that way. Sitting in your house with your gun in your mouth? That does sound daunting, but run around pumped up with adrenaline until the coppers do the job for you? Path of least resistance that seems, relatively at least.

Really, I just think he wasn't much of a tactician nor a particularly skilled rifleman, and didn't have much of a plan, other than a one way trip.

[Alexander PhiAlipson]

Nah, I"m saying it's an SKS or Mini-30

Scalise, a second baseman for Team GOP, and members of his protective detail were shot by a man described by witnesses as a white man in his 50s. Witnesses have estimated at least 50 rounds were fired from what authorities described as an M4 assault weapon and said the suspect also carried a handgun as he moved from the outfield to the infield firing.

I know how much they like to say assault rifle, but everyone's going with M4, C--and they are quite quiet.

[Smitty-48]

Really, if you think you're going to have to shoot somebody someday, and you're concerned that you won't be able to do it, it has nothing to do with being in combat or whatever, it's all repetition, just keep going through the motions, over and over and over, until it is instinctive. Ingrain the muscle memory, and when the adrenaline hits, you'll just go off like clockwork, without even thinking about it, you don't even need live ammo, you don't have to go to the range, just draw-aim-click, draw-aim-click, until it is second nature. We're already training the troops to shoot to kill, instimctively, long before they ever put a live round down range, and the best tactical training is not even on the range, the muscle memory is ingrained dry.

When you take the troops to the range, that's really more about safety, making sure they are switched on and know what they are doing, but that's not where you train them to kill, nor does it have much value in terms of tactical engagements, nor do they have to deploy for combat, to be reliable to put rounds down upon contact, right after 16 weeks of battleschool, is actually when they are at their most formidable, or as I like to say, green troops ate the best troops, experience actually degrades the weapon system from its peak.

[Alexander PhiAlipson]

Really, if you think you're going to have to shoot somebody someday, and you're concerned that you won't be able to do it, it has nothing to do with being in combat or whatever, it's all repetition, just keep going through the motions, over and over and over, until it is instinctive. Ingrain the muscle memory, and when the adrenaline hits, you'll just go off like clockwork, without even thinking about it, you don't even need live ammo, you don't have to go to the range, just draw-aim-click, draw-aim-click, until it is second nature. We're already training the troops to shoot to kill, insticntively, long before they ever put a live round down range, and the best tactical training is not even on the range, the muscle memory is ingrained dry.

It's also good for the firing pin.

[C-Mag]

Nah, I"m saying it's an SKS or Mini-30

Scalise, a second baseman for Team GOP, and members of his protective detail were shot by a man described by witnesses as a white man in his 50s. Witnesses have estimated at least 50 rounds were fired from what authorities described as an M4 assault weapon and said the suspect also carried a handgun as he moved from the outfield to the infield firing.

I know how much they like to say assault rifle, but everyone's going with M4, C--and they are quite quiet.

I gotta stick with what I heard and my experience. I'm betting on SKS.
What the Hell does the press know about weapons anyway, they are almost always wrong on stuff like this.