Mattis hearing

[ssu]

Heck, I still like Dick Nixon, when I listen to the Nixon tapes, I laugh my ass off. LBJ Tapes; also Hi-larious.

Listen to those tapes long enough, and you'll realize Trump is even headed compared to those two.

You mean level-headed or even-tempered? Trump, hmm, well LBJ had his oddities.

Perhaps, but few years in the office can get to anybody.

[adwinistrator]

I like Nixon's tapes too

I'm guessing that's for different reasons than Smitty...

[adwinistrator]

You're not waiting and seeing, ssu, all you're doing is concern trolling, in every single thread, so Finnish Pogue; heal thyself.

Disclaimer: I haven't been reading all the conversations you and ssu have had here, not talking about specifics.

I just wanted to point out, because I've seen the term "concern trolling" take on way too broad a meaning, that it does not mean that someone is expressing concerns you don't agree with, of feel they shouldn't have.

concern trolling is when your opponent pretends to be on your side, but disingenuously feigns concern over a tertiary concern in an attempt to derail the conversation and create infighting among the group.

If someone here is pretending to be on the Trump-train, and starts stating that Trump needs to publicly denounce (or embrace) stormfront, with the intent of causing an argument inside the group, then they are concern trolling.

If someone here is stating they are not on the Trump-train, and then lists their concerns, that is NOT concern trolling. That is just someone you disagree with, and you don't feel there concerns are valid...

[StCapps]

If someone here is stating they are not on the Trump-train, and then lists their concerns, that is NOT concern trolling. That is just someone you disagree with, and you don't feel there concerns are valid...

Yes but if they aren't on the Trump train while pretending to be on it and then they act concerned about Trump's behavior with the intent of pissing off those on the Trump train, then it's concern trolling. This is what ssu and penner have been doing as of late, pretending they are giving Trump a chance and then falling for fake news that tells them a narrative that portrays Trump's behavior as concerning, and then shouting about it from the rooftops to let Trump supporters know they think they should be concerned. That's concern trolling 101.

[adwinistrator]

If someone here is stating they are not on the Trump-train, and then lists their concerns, that is NOT concern trolling. That is just someone you disagree with, and you don't feel there concerns are valid...

Yes but if they aren't on the Trump train while pretending to be on it and then they act concerned about Trump's behavior with the intent of pissing off those on the Trump train, then it's concern trolling. This is what ssu and penner have been doing as of late, pretending they are giving Trump a chance and then falling for fake news that tells them a narrative that portrays Trump's behavior as concerning, and then shouting about it from the rooftops to let Trump supporters know they think they should be concerned. That's concern trolling 101.

That's why I put the disclaimer at the top

I just see lots of circumstances where someone is on your side, but they're 60/40. Then when they have (to them) legit concerns, people jump on them as concern trolls because they're concerned about things that the 100%ers think is not a problem.

They weren't lying about their support (maybe they didn't explain it was 60/40 well enough), and they aren't lying about their concerns. They're not being disingenuous, but getting called out as if even they don't believe what they're saying.

That's all I was trying to point to, and I am not talking about specifics of any user or conversations on this forum. I've seen this happen multiple times on "my side", and seen it happen a lot on "the other side"...

I'm sure you can picture the college fair-weather feminist at the student club, who speaks up to mention how there are some issues that men need support for, and gets shouted down by the radicals for "concern trolling" them...

It gets used as "you're 100% with us, or you are a troll who is trying to divide us."

Also, I'd like to think this is not a "Donald Trump Forum", but is a place for people to discuss and debate many viewpoints and beliefs.

[StCapps]

Trolling doesn't have to be intentional. You can be ignorantly making assumptions or asking questions where the net result is trolling people without realizing it. Concern trolling is no different, some concern trolls do it intentionally, other concern trolls do it accidentally with the same tools used by the intentional concern trolls.

[adwinistrator]

Trolling doesn't have to be intentional. You can be ignorantly making assumptions or asking questions where the net result is trolling people without realizing it. Concern trolling is no different.

Truly post-modern! Bravo!

[Smitty-48]

ssu has brought up his concerns to me, literally thousands of times now, exact same concerns, in every single thread, in every single instance where we do not amplify ssu's concerns about Trump. Heard you the first fifty thousand times, folks, you're concerned about Trump, got it, roger that, good copy, message received, I'm not even saying ssu's concerns are not valid, I never dismissed ssu's concerns, but regardless of those concerns, I'm going to give Trump a chance, so you can stop now, because I'm not changing my mind on giving Trump a chance, until he does something to change my mind on that, and he hasn't done anything as of yet, to make me say, "OK, fuck Trump, he's blown it now, just impeach this clown", but rest assured, if he does something that warrants that, I'll let you know, so you can stop lobbying me about it, in the meantime.

[adwinistrator]

I'm going to give Trump a chance, so you can stop now, because I'm not changing my mind on giving Trump a chance, until he does something to change my mind on that, and he hasn't done anything as of yet, to make me say, "OK, fuck Trump, he's blown it now, just impeach this clown", but rest assured, if he does something that warrants that, I'll let you know, so you can stop lobbying me about it, in the meantime.

I totally get that, I was not speaking to the conduct of you, or ssu, or anyone else, I was really just trying to bring up a trend I've been seeing for over 2 years where this phrase, and the mentality behind it, turns into a purity test that ruins discussion groups.

Now, just to clarify... If you do end up stating "OK, fuck Trump, he's blown it now, just impeach this clown", and people begin accusing you of concern trolling, I think you'll have a clear understanding of the problem I'm trying to point out.

Btw, sorry for derailing the discussion...

So, does anyone remember when Mattis got involved with Theranos?

[Smitty-48]

I'm going to give Trump a chance, so you can stop now, because I'm not changing my mind on giving Trump a chance, until he does something to change my mind on that, and he hasn't done anything as of yet, to make me say, "OK, fuck Trump, he's blown it now, just impeach this clown", but rest assured, if he does something that warrants that, I'll let you know, so you can stop lobbying me about it, in the meantime.

I totally get that, I was not speaking to the conduct of you, or ssu, or anyone else, I was really just trying to bring up a trend I've been seeing for over 2 years where this phrase, and the mentality behind it, turns into a purity test that ruins discussion groups.

Now, just to clarify... If you do end up stating "OK, fuck Trump, he's blown it now, just impeach this clown", and people begin accusing you of concern trolling, I think you'll have a clear understanding of the problem I'm trying to point out.

People ceaselessly accuse me of being a troll, so what would be the difference?