Current US Military
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Re: Current US Military
bear in mind, at the time, nobody in America was aware of anything going on
the War Scare was only happening in the Soviet Union, America was totally oblivious, nobody knew
NATO Exercise Able Archer, OKO satellite false launch warning, Soviets at the brink of an accidental first strike
we had no idea, although everybody suspected that sort of thing was what was going to start the war
the War Scare was only happening in the Soviet Union, America was totally oblivious, nobody knew
NATO Exercise Able Archer, OKO satellite false launch warning, Soviets at the brink of an accidental first strike
we had no idea, although everybody suspected that sort of thing was what was going to start the war
Nec Aspera Terrent
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Re: Current US Military
as a boy, I remember thinking that it was actually in progress
President Reagan called the Soviets an "Evil Empire"
the Soviets shot down KAL 007 on 1 September
Hezbollah bombed the Marines in Beirut and American forces went on high alert worldwide, on 23 October
America invaded Grenada on 25 October
I was kind of seeing it from the Soviet point of view, it definitely seemed to be escalating rapidly in the moment
President Reagan called the Soviets an "Evil Empire"
the Soviets shot down KAL 007 on 1 September
Hezbollah bombed the Marines in Beirut and American forces went on high alert worldwide, on 23 October
America invaded Grenada on 25 October
I was kind of seeing it from the Soviet point of view, it definitely seemed to be escalating rapidly in the moment
Nec Aspera Terrent
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Re: Current US Military
Seems to me that it makes sense to contain the Bear.
It was getting a little too frisky.
Let's check in with Smitty now.
Did you see this coming under the Biden administration or is this a surprise?
An early show of strength by the Woke administration... doesn't seem like a Karen move to me.
Or am I wrong?
It was getting a little too frisky.
Let's check in with Smitty now.
Did you see this coming under the Biden administration or is this a surprise?
An early show of strength by the Woke administration... doesn't seem like a Karen move to me.
Or am I wrong?
Deep down tho, I still thirst to kill you and eat you. Ultra Chimp can't help it.. - Smitty
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Re: Current US Military
it's not Biden, this is bigger than any one Administration
Bush incited Cold War Two when America withdrew from ABM 72' way back in 2002
Obama then took the ball and ran with it, he didn't like Putin, so he went after Putin in Central Europe
Trump did nothing to change anything, he just went along with what the Pentagon wanted to do
I never believed the Cold War was about ideology
it was simply World War Two frozen in place where it ended
a dispute over the Potsdam Agreement from Yalta with regard to the occupation zones in Germany
then the hydrogen bombs were introduced, and it's been all about the hydrogen bombs ever since
Cold War is really just an euphemism for Arms Race
Bush incited Cold War Two when America withdrew from ABM 72' way back in 2002
Obama then took the ball and ran with it, he didn't like Putin, so he went after Putin in Central Europe
Trump did nothing to change anything, he just went along with what the Pentagon wanted to do
I never believed the Cold War was about ideology
it was simply World War Two frozen in place where it ended
a dispute over the Potsdam Agreement from Yalta with regard to the occupation zones in Germany
then the hydrogen bombs were introduced, and it's been all about the hydrogen bombs ever since
Cold War is really just an euphemism for Arms Race
Nec Aspera Terrent
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Re: Current US Military
"MAD" was a theory enacted by McNamara in the 60's
it lasted through the 70's, the so called Detente era
but the Soviets were secretly building up their forces all that time,
because they didn't believe America would stick to MAD
so then America abandoned MAD,
when President Reagan enacted the Strategic Defense Initiative
on 23 March 1983,
in the spring
by the fall, in September, the Soviets were at the brink of war, although secretly, behind the Iron Curtain
it lasted through the 70's, the so called Detente era
but the Soviets were secretly building up their forces all that time,
because they didn't believe America would stick to MAD
so then America abandoned MAD,
when President Reagan enacted the Strategic Defense Initiative
on 23 March 1983,
in the spring
by the fall, in September, the Soviets were at the brink of war, although secretly, behind the Iron Curtain
Nec Aspera Terrent
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Re: Current US Military
it all starts in 1962 with the Cuban Missile Crisis
America was vastly overrating the Soviets,
there was no MAD, the Soviets couldn't strike back, then didn't stand a chance
so in late 60''s, the Soviets switched from land war to the high seas
and they shifted all their resources from conventional forces to nuclear forces
and by 1983, they had closed the gap, now they had the ability to obliterate the CONUS for the first time
turns out, America wasn't having that, so America then shifted from MAD to counterforce
America was vastly overrating the Soviets,
there was no MAD, the Soviets couldn't strike back, then didn't stand a chance
so in late 60''s, the Soviets switched from land war to the high seas
and they shifted all their resources from conventional forces to nuclear forces
and by 1983, they had closed the gap, now they had the ability to obliterate the CONUS for the first time
turns out, America wasn't having that, so America then shifted from MAD to counterforce
Nec Aspera Terrent
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Re: Current US Military
So what America is just calling their bluff?Smitty-48 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 18, 2021 1:03 pmit all starts in 1962 with the Cuban Missile Crisis
America was vastly overrating the Soviets,
there was no MAD, the Soviets couldn't strike back, then didn't stand a chance
so in late 60''s, the Soviets switched from land war to the high seas
and they shifted all their resources from conventional forces to nuclear forces
and by 1983, they had closed the gap, now they had the ability to obliterate the CONUS for the first time
turns out, America wasn't having that, so America then shifted from MAD to counterforce
Big ol' game of chicken.
Deep down tho, I still thirst to kill you and eat you. Ultra Chimp can't help it.. - Smitty
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Re: Current US Military
in 62' ? No, America had convinced itself that the Soviets were much stronger than they wereDrYouth wrote: ↑Thu Mar 18, 2021 3:10 pmSo what America is just calling their bluff?Smitty-48 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 18, 2021 1:03 pmit all starts in 1962 with the Cuban Missile Crisis
America was vastly overrating the Soviets,
there was no MAD, the Soviets couldn't strike back, then didn't stand a chance
so in late 60''s, the Soviets switched from land war to the high seas
and they shifted all their resources from conventional forces to nuclear forces
and by 1983, they had closed the gap, now they had the ability to obliterate the CONUS for the first time
turns out, America wasn't having that, so America then shifted from MAD to counterforce
Big ol' game of chicken.
so America went all the way to the brink of massive retaliation with 800 B-52's at failsafe
the Soviets were bluffing, but America bought it and escalated all the way to the brink of World War Three
the Soviets then backed down secretly, behind the scenes, cutting a deal with Kennedy
the Soviets however vowed that they would not do that again next time, next time they would be ready
so they signed treaties with America, bringing in a decade of "Detente"
all the while secretly building up their forces to close the gap on America while America was standing pat
Nec Aspera Terrent
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Re: Current US Military
the problem for the Soviets back in 62' was that they just didn't have the kit
they didn't have the bombers, they didn't have the missiles
America thought they had 700 long range bombers, in reality they had a few dozen ( "Bomber Gap" )
America thought they had hundreds of ICBM's, in reality they had a few dozen ( "Missile Gap" )
the MICC drank their own kool-aid
the Soviets used that to bluff, but it backfired in Cuba and they had to back down
during the 70's they shifted their resources from the land war buffer zone in Europe, to submarines at sea
they started building "Nuclear Powered Strategic Ballistic Missile Carrying Heavy Submarine Cruisers"
what America calls Ship Submersible Ballistic Missile Nuclear ( SSBN )
starting with the NATO reporting name Delta Class early in the 70's
finishing with the NATO reporting name Typhoon Class in the early 80's
so by the early 80's, the Soviets had successfully closed the gap
they no longer had to send their puny Yankee Class SSBN's to off the coast of Bermuda
now they had the mighty Typhoons under the Polar ice cap capable of a first strike on the CONUS
they didn't have the bombers, they didn't have the missiles
America thought they had 700 long range bombers, in reality they had a few dozen ( "Bomber Gap" )
America thought they had hundreds of ICBM's, in reality they had a few dozen ( "Missile Gap" )
the MICC drank their own kool-aid
the Soviets used that to bluff, but it backfired in Cuba and they had to back down
during the 70's they shifted their resources from the land war buffer zone in Europe, to submarines at sea
they started building "Nuclear Powered Strategic Ballistic Missile Carrying Heavy Submarine Cruisers"
what America calls Ship Submersible Ballistic Missile Nuclear ( SSBN )
starting with the NATO reporting name Delta Class early in the 70's
finishing with the NATO reporting name Typhoon Class in the early 80's
so by the early 80's, the Soviets had successfully closed the gap
they no longer had to send their puny Yankee Class SSBN's to off the coast of Bermuda
now they had the mighty Typhoons under the Polar ice cap capable of a first strike on the CONUS
Nec Aspera Terrent
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Re: Current US Military
so you don't actually see the test of MAD in 1962
you don't find out if MAD is actually stable until 1982
turns out it's not so stable after all,
both sides immediately abandoned MAD and started Reductive Escalation to counterforce
the Americans were right, the Typhoon SSBN was an inherent First Strike Weapon
Cuba was not the Nuclear Pearl Harbor, they were bluffing
on the night of 26 September 1983 when the Soviets almost launched on false warning, they weren't bluffing
there was a Typhoon parked up under the ice that night, while we were all watching Jeopardy or whatever
if Stan Petrov hadn't put a stop to it, we would have been hit with a first strike out of the blue,
there was no warning on the news, we would have got launched on by mistake, no idea why it was happening,
you don't find out if MAD is actually stable until 1982
turns out it's not so stable after all,
both sides immediately abandoned MAD and started Reductive Escalation to counterforce
the Americans were right, the Typhoon SSBN was an inherent First Strike Weapon
Cuba was not the Nuclear Pearl Harbor, they were bluffing
on the night of 26 September 1983 when the Soviets almost launched on false warning, they weren't bluffing
there was a Typhoon parked up under the ice that night, while we were all watching Jeopardy or whatever
if Stan Petrov hadn't put a stop to it, we would have been hit with a first strike out of the blue,
there was no warning on the news, we would have got launched on by mistake, no idea why it was happening,
Nec Aspera Terrent