War With Communists

[TheReal_ND]

BUT COMMUNISM HAS NEVER BEEN TRIED CORRECTLY

I wonder why neonazis don't use the same line. Perhaps they are more honest?

Do you mean fascism or specifically the NDSAP? Because if the former, it has a long and storied history if you are willing to frame the Ceasars as fascist. I am. Also, it survived Hitler under Franco and some argue Pinochet but I'm not sure about the later.

[SuburbanFarmer]

This turned into a really good thread.

If anything, the lesson of the Czars was that massive income inequality is not sustainable. As Dan said, "if you don't feel their pain, they will make you feel it".

Optimal human governance seems to lie in a sort of middle-ground between the ideas of Anarcho-Capitalism, and full-on Communism. Either extreme leads to extreme inequality, and the boom/bust cycle of Revolution. You simply can't have it either way.

[C-Mag]

When I visited historic St. Petersburg, Dacha after fabulous Dacha, immense, overwrought, with complex water-fountain systems, all unimaginably expensive, the first thing I said to my wife, Gwynne, was, "no wonder these people had a revolution."

With better handling the Russian Empire could have avoided it's fate. Many Monarchies could make a peaceful transition from autocracy to democracy, to say that Russians would be totally incapable of that is quite racist in my view. But that's the problem with absolute monarchs: when you have an inept one, you have serious problems. Add to that a weak central government (as the land is so enormous with a multitude of different people in it), you have problems.

As my grandparents were born in Imperial Russia (though in an Grand Duchy), I would definately choose Romanov rule than the Soviet Union and Stalin. No difficulty in making that decision. Heck, there's a bit difference things not perhaps working well and masses people being slaughtered. The idea that Communism "was better" is like thinking that Sherman's march to the sea was good for the people of Georgia. Put them in place, made them understand that they had lost the war.

IMO, we see glimpses of the same thing in the US with our 100 years of Progressive policies combined with crony capitalism. People have been voting for a serious change to the system since at least the mid-90s, and we are not getting reforms, just deeper entrenchment by swamp dwellers. Those in power in any empire are not about to give up their status quo easily, their arrogant, they feel entitled, and superior to the average folks.

[GloryofGreece]

Thing about the Soviet Union was, the Communists were the urbane elites and they all lived in the cities, Lenin and Trotsky, these guys were public intellectuals, they didn't even live in Russia, they were hanging out at the Cafe Central in Vienna Austria, with Hitler and Sigmund Freud by the way, they all hung out at the same coffee shop.

Anyways, they didn't have any clue how to run things outside of the urban paradigm, and they had no understanding of agriculture, they weren't farmers they didn't know anything about farming, and they had no relationship with the peasants, they didn't know them and they didn't understand them.

So, there was always a wide gulf between Soviet sucesses in science and industry and the disaster which was Soviet agriculture, and there was always deep resentment and dissent by the peasants against the elites in the cities. Agriculture and the peasants were always the weak links in the chain of socialism. Not only did they not want to play along, but the agricultural paradigm didn't fit neatly into the Communist obsession with central planning.

It was only Koba who had any understanding of Russia amongst the Bolsheviks, it was only Koba who understood that the peasants would never be onside for the revolution, and this is why he basically starved them to death in favour of funding the industrial side of the equation, as he said "death solves all problems, one man, one problem, no man, no problem".

Vietnam being a fairly large agricultural society was better at implementing central planning into their countryside or not really?

[GloryofGreece]

BUT COMMUNISM HAS NEVER BEEN TRIED CORRECTLY

I wonder why neonazis don't use the same line. Perhaps they are more honest?

Do you mean fascism or specifically the NDSAP? Because if the former, it has a long and storied history if you are willing to frame the Ceasars as fascist. I am. Also, it survived Hitler under Franco and some argue Pinochet but I'm not sure about the later.

Don't think it applicable to Caesar really at all. He took power (tyrant) and his family retained it (monarchy).

[TheReal_ND]

Well then you will not want to bother listening to cultured thug. Fascism is one of those things that many people have trouble defining.

[C-Mag]

Well then you will not want to bother listening to cultured thug. Fascism is one of those things that many people have trouble defining.

Nah, it's easy.

Fascism: A collectivist social political movement with high importance on nationalism and a economic model of government working jointly with business to further political goals.

[Martin Hash]

Well then you will not want to bother listening to cultured thug. Fascism is one of those things that many people have trouble defining.

Nah, it's easy.

Fascism: A collectivist social political movement with high importance on nationalism and a economic model of government working jointly with business to further political goals.

ditto

[TheReal_ND]

But democrats are the real fascists. I think people put too much emphasis on the collectivist part personally. It's more an absence of democracy and anti-liberal position than some kind of communist lite like people make it out to be.

[C-Mag]

But democrats are the real fascists. I think people put too much emphasis on the collectivist part personally. It's more an absence of democracy and anti-liberal position than some kind of communist lite like people make it out to be.

The collectivist part is HIGHLY significant for 2 reasons.

1. Correctly indicates Fascism is a Socialist movement.
2. All Collectivist Ideologies place the Political goals of the State ahead of Individual Liberties, Freedom and Welfare.

Not understanding this is why even bright people like Dan Carlin can see all the similarities between Nazi Germany and Communist Russia but inaccurately call one Right and the other Left. They are both neither, they are Collectivist. When you are a Collectivist, because the State comes first, you are free to Kill, Jail, or move any human you want. They are merely a tool for the State.