The Fucking Thatcher Thread

[StCapps]

As with all the leftist enemy sympathizers in Britain, he's got nothing, just some prattle about the government not handing out free milk, which, as any reasonable person would understand, is not the role of government at all.

I bet you have the best criticisms of Thatcher of us all Smitty, and you're probably her biggest fan on this forum.

Well I could criticize Thatcher for all sorts of things, but I judge her on the aggregate, in context, against her peers, not against some perfect standard which no human being could ever attain.

If Thatcher Haters stopped to do that though, their hatred of her wouldn't hold up to scrutiny, so naturally they stick to judging her against some perfect standard which no human being could ever attain, that way they can delude themselves into believing their Thatcher Hating is justified. It's no doubt why their arguments against her suck so bad, the same is true of Trump Haters.

A politician isn't perfect, so they suck.
That's just lame material, and if you call them out on that, then they just assume you're a nuthugger of said politician,
that way they can write off any more well thought out opinions that they disagree with, without even thinking.
/shrugs

[Smitty-48]

I bet you have the best criticisms of Thatcher of us all Smitty, and you're probably her biggest fan on this forum.

Well I could criticize Thatcher for all sorts of things, but I judge her on the aggregate, in context, against her peers, not against some perfect standard which no human being could ever attain.

If Thatcher Haters stopped to do that though, their hatred of her wouldn't hold up to scrutiny, so naturally they stick to judging her against some perfect standard which no human being could ever attain, that way they can delude themselves into believing their Thatcher Hating is justified. It's no doubt why their arguments against her suck so bad, the same is true of Trump Haters.

A politician isn't perfect, so they suck.
That's just lame material, and if you call them out on that, they just assume you're a nuthugger of said politician.
/shrugs

My main criticism of her is that she didn't go far enough when she had the chance, she had the political capital for a moment there, for an even more radical overhaul of the British public sector, but she gave in to the crying of the hysterical leftists and took her foot off the gas, just when she should have doubled down.

In the end, she was a mommy, so her maternal nature got the better of her, should have crushed it out of the park, but she pulled her punch at the last moment, feeling sorry for the little fellas. She was actually a big softie, blubbering about the Belgrano for forty minutes after the sinking? Pull yourself together PM, Winston Churchill never shed one tear for the enemy.

[DrYouth]

Let's just look at British gas, sold off cheap for £450 million now earning that much per year for it's shareholders.
2014 and 2015...

Profits at British Gas have risen by 31% to £574m for the 12 months to 31 December as gas consumption increased.

The rise in operating profits compared with £439m for the previous year.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-35601674

British Telecom made £1.9 billion this year.
Electricity companies make several billions per year.

Smitty or Fife will tell you that private companies are run more efficiently which is why their profits are so huge. In reality privatisation led to huge job cuts and increased prices for customers.
Privatisation was a short term gain which bailed out the Thatcher government but a long term loss for British consumers and exchequer revenues.

So for the most part Monte has been knocked back by Capps... with plenty of assist from his tag team menace.
Still haven't really heard a response to this post.

Like I said... the truth about privatization remains a pretty central social policy divide between the left and right.

Given that I have abandoned many of the sacred cows of the left on this forum...
I'm prepared to eat hamburgers on this one....

But at least post a rebuttal.

[StCapps]

Let's just look at British gas, sold off cheap for £450 million now earning that much per year for it's shareholders.
2014 and 2015...

Profits at British Gas have risen by 31% to £574m for the 12 months to 31 December as gas consumption increased.

The rise in operating profits compared with £439m for the previous year.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-35601674

British Telecom made £1.9 billion this year.
Electricity companies make several billions per year.

Smitty or Fife will tell you that private companies are run more efficiently which is why their profits are so huge. In reality privatisation led to huge job cuts and increased prices for customers.
Privatisation was a short term gain which bailed out the Thatcher government but a long term loss for British consumers and exchequer revenues.

So for the most part Monte has been knocked back by Capps... with plenty of assist from his tag team menace.
Still haven't really heard a response to this post.

Like I said... the truth about privatization remains a pretty central social policy divide between the left and right.

Given that I have abandoned many of the sacred cows of the left on this forum...
I'm prepared to eat hamburgers on this one....

But at least post a rebuttal.

Smitty or Fife will tell you that private companies are run more efficiently which is why their profits are so huge

Or Capps. When the private sector took over, of course they started growing and are worth far more now than when they were sold, that's how it's suppose to work. British consumers are far better off after her round of privatization than before, the jobs were going to be lost in those industries anyway, Thatcher saved jobs via privatization, by keeping those British Industries more competitive than they would have been without it.

The public sector was suffocating growth in Britain by crowding out the private sector pre-Thatcher, who knows how much worse off Britain would be without her buying them some time with her reforms, she was a breath of fresh of air.

Monte knew our rebuttal and pre-emptively stated it, in order to frame our rebuttal in a way that makes it seem like it doesn't actually rebut his entire argument, but it does.

[Smitty-48]

Thatcher got the runaway inflation under control, and the British economy went on a huge boom as a result, peaking at 6% GDP growth, which would have people dancing in the streets now, currently the British economy is growing at 0.4%.

It's quite simple really, the British public sector economy enacted to fight the Second World War, had, by the 1970's, become so bloated and out of control, with previous governments ceaselessly caving in to unionized interests, that it had literally ground the economy to a halt and the UK was crumbling into disorder and disrepair as a result, Thatcher was hired to get this under control, and she did so, just as she promised to. Bravo Zulu.

There were winners and there were losers, there's no getting around that, the public sector entrenched interests lost ground, but they had to, in order to get things back on the rails again for the economy writ large, for the future as well as the present.

Did she miracle up the post scarcity utopia as promised by the left? No, but neither they did they, quite the opposite, so they are in no position to criticize her for doing what had to be done, when they didn't have the resolve to do so, because they were so beholden to their unionized entrenched interests.

It is not the role of government to hand out free milk, it's not the role of government to hand out make work to unions at extortion prices without them producing anything until the country falls into disorder and disrepair, but it is the role of government to get that under control, by reigning it in, even if the leftists cry hysterically about it, especially when the leftists cry hysterically about in fact.

[DrYouth]

Did she miracle up the post scarcity utopia as promised by the left? No, but neither they did they, quite the opposite, so they are in no position to criticize her for doing what had to be done, when they didn't have the resolve to do so, because they were so beholden to their unionized entrenched interests.

Good rebuttal...

It's back to you Monte.

Cappy and Smitty are winning on points... getting to the middle rounds here.

[Smitty-48]

Ah fuck! The Leafs have been playing a game this whole time and they are crushing Carolina 8-1, the tv guide said it was on at 1900, but it was a matinee game, and I missed it all, because I was here defending Margaret Thatcher.

Fucking NHL, what the fuck is up with a matinee game on a Tuesday afternoon? Balderdash!

Ah well, the Iron Lady deserves her due, hopefully this game is on repeat later tonight.

[Speaker to Animals]

Did she not take a nation that was besieged by Irish terrorists and challenged by third world South American powers, and return that nation to a world power?

Interesting how the labor party never really unwound her reforms and they certainly were not keen on losing the military power she had helped to rebuild.

She obviously shocked a lot of the left to the core, domestically, and I really can't have much to say either way there. But the UK is better off for having her than not. The path they were on was pretty rough.

[StCapps]

Ah fuck! The Leafs have been playing a game this whole time and they are crushing Carolina 8-1, the tv guide said it was on at 1900, but it was a matinee game, and I missed it all, because I was here defending Margaret Thatcher.

Fucking NHL, what the fuck is up with a matinee game on a Tuesday afternoon? Balderdash!

Ah well, the Iron Lady deserves her due, hopefully this game is on repeat later tonight.

100th Anniversary Game, thousands of kiddies showed up and the Leafs were wearing Toronto Arenas throwbacks. Fuck if I knew you were missing it, I would have said something earlier, though it caught me by surprise too, my dad told me it was on, and I was like, "isn't that a repeat of last nights game or something?", and he's like, "no it's live, started at 2", and sure enough, he was right. Could have sworn NHL.com had it listed as night game yesterday too.

[Smitty-48]

Marns 4pts, Bozie 4 pts, JVR 3 pts. Dayum, that line is carrying them of late.