The Professor Watch List

[Paulo]

See I think our culture right now is "superior". I don't mean that in an insulting way. I should have clarified. I meant it in a way that if this was like a game we have the high score. We do have the best economy. We are the top dog everyone is gunning for. I'm not stating that we are superior like genetically or any of that bullshit. Just stating that we are doing really well juxtaposed to other nations. Sorry for the confusion, I can see how it would come across as hate speechy. I also agree with your economic points of emphasis.

I did not thought of that like insulting, but it is a common trend coming from some comments that america is somewhat this promise land better than "others'", and I am pleased that you clarified anyway. I was just pointing out my view.

By the way, I just read an article from a teacher that is in that "professor witch hunt list" , it is very upsetting.

[LVH2]

I don't know what kind of school you went, but that is not my recollection of mine. We did not accept professors wasting our precious and expensive time with BS and subjects that were not in our best interest. They did have an extensive curricular plan, with the courses and the subjects, I never knew or asked about my teachers religions or if they were this and that. They had a class to give and they did, some were good some were bad.

The only class I remember to have nice discussions was Philosophy. We have to agree that this is an appropriate class to discuss all kinds of crazy stuff. Again, I don't remember anyone being offended or wining about some other opinions or ideas, we listen we talked and we went out for the next class.
Sorry if I can't agree about going to college to learn about goofy ideas, that's what you do with your friends in a football game. I went to college to get the tools to be a productive human being,to learn to be good at my profession, not a fool.
If you are such a simple mind that you get indoctrinated by some teacher, it means that you will be indoctrinated by some fool in your city, it's not the teacher or the college's fault.

I guess this all controversy comes with all the fear that americans feel, all the time. Kind of general insecurity. Why the rest of the world don't feel the need to have Scientology, or discuss if the man went on the moon, or if climate change is real or not, or if you have to have so many bathrooms separations. C'mon that's bit too much. I even heard that some guy has a theory that the earth is flat!!!!!! american of course.

If you study philosophy, politics, economics or even law or psychology, you are studying a number of competing outlooks and ideologies. I don't know what other approach there is.

Well, I do. That is ideological indoctrination. Which is what I oppose.

This is the subject at hand. You seem to be talking about stem or professional education, eg accounting. Even in many of those fields, there are competing ideas, and a good education should expose you to many of them.

[Paulo]

I don't know what kind of school you went, but that is not my recollection of mine. We did not accept professors wasting our precious and expensive time with BS and subjects that were not in our best interest. They did have an extensive curricular plan, with the courses and the subjects, I never knew or asked about my teachers religions or if they were this and that. They had a class to give and they did, some were good some were bad.

The only class I remember to have nice discussions was Philosophy. We have to agree that this is an appropriate class to discuss all kinds of crazy stuff. Again, I don't remember anyone being offended or wining about some other opinions or ideas, we listen we talked and we went out for the next class.
Sorry if I can't agree about going to college to learn about goofy ideas, that's what you do with your friends in a football game. I went to college to get the tools to be a productive human being,to learn to be good at my profession, not a fool.
If you are such a simple mind that you get indoctrinated by some teacher, it means that you will be indoctrinated by some fool in your city, it's not the teacher or the college's fault.

I guess this all controversy comes with all the fear that americans feel, all the time. Kind of general insecurity. Why the rest of the world don't feel the need to have Scientology, or discuss if the man went on the moon, or if climate change is real or not, or if you have to have so many bathrooms separations. C'mon that's bit too much. I even heard that some guy has a theory that the earth is flat!!!!!! american of course.

If you study philosophy, politics, economics or even law or psychology, you are studying a number of competing outlooks and ideologies. I don't know what other approach there is.

Well, I do. That is ideological indoctrination. Which is what I oppose.

This is the subject at hand. You seem to be talking about stem or professional education, eg accounting. Even in many of those fields, there are competing ideas, and a good education should expose you to many of them.

Yes, since I am an engineer. Competing ideas have always been around. There is so many ways to create a building. How to calculate iron reinforcement, competing ideas to find better ways, safer, economically more viable. I can't see how one competing idea that was aimed to bring the building down would prosper. It's not the same thing, when you try to justify absurdity. These are not ideas that have any valor for the human being.
You always will find some crazy people to follow crazy ideas, that does not mean that those ideas deserve to be heard.
Ideological indoctrination always existed, some people give a damn other don't. It's a pretty profound discussion.
Let me put it this way:
Once I know that a school has in it's academic plan, to teach scientology, I will not let my daughter go to that school. The reason? There is nothing in that idea that will improve my daughter as a human being, on the contrary. I guess I will have to go all "libertarian" on this and claim personal responsibility.

[Dand]

I don't know what kind of school you went, but that is not my recollection of mine. We did not accept professors wasting our precious and expensive time with BS and subjects that were not in our best interest. They did have an extensive curricular plan, with the courses and the subjects, I never knew or asked about my teachers religions or if they were this and that. They had a class to give and they did, some were good some were bad.

This is why we don't win anymore. Take a good look at this shit right here. American education is a fucking joke. Look at it! Brazil is even laughing at us.

It's not a joke for students in STEM fields, at least in my experience. Those are much more like what Paulo said and don't seem to be infiltrated by marxists.

In college I took a film class (as an interesting elective) and the professor turned out to be on a list like this one because he was a leftist. I wasn't surprised to learn he was but in the class he was professional and knowledgeable about his subject. It's definitely possible for people to have radical ideologies but still manage to teach a class effectively.

This list is presenting information and providing sources for it. I don't think it is McCarthyism at all (that Prop Or Not website from last week accusing all non-establishment media of being Russian shills was real McCarthyism) and just gives more information to students when choosing their classes. I used Rate My Professor and asked students who had taken a professor's class what they thought of it before scheduling because I don't want to waste my time with a crappy class. As long as the information in this list is accurate it just lets students make more informed choices.

[Paulo]

I don't know what kind of school you went, but that is not my recollection of mine. We did not accept professors wasting our precious and expensive time with BS and subjects that were not in our best interest. They did have an extensive curricular plan, with the courses and the subjects, I never knew or asked about my teachers religions or if they were this and that. They had a class to give and they did, some were good some were bad.

This is why we don't win anymore. Take a good look at this shit right here. American education is a fucking joke. Look at it! Brazil is even laughing at us.

It's not a joke for students in STEM fields, at least in my experience. Those are much more like what Paulo said and don't seem to be infiltrated by marxists.

In college I took a film class (as an interesting elective) and the professor turned out to be on a list like this one because he was a leftist. I wasn't surprised to learn he was but in the class he was professional and knowledgeable about his subject. It's definitely possible for people to have radical ideologies but still manage to teach a class effectively.

This list is presenting information and providing sources for it. I don't think it is McCarthyism at all (that Prop Or Not website from last week accusing all non-establishment media of being Russian shills was real McCarthyism) and just gives more information to students when choosing their classes. I used Rate My Professor and asked students who had taken a professor's class what they thought of it before scheduling because I don't want to waste my time with a crappy class. As long as the information in this list is accurate it just lets students make more informed choices.

"As long as the information in this list is accurate it just lets students make more informed choices."

Isn't that the same argument to fill hell with people with good intensions? I cannot see how this will not be used to a witch hunt, it's just a fact.

I will never agree to give students or parents any tool to persecute teachers, even with the kindest intentions. It's just my firm believe. The task of a teacher is so hard that you cannot do that. Have you seen a tool called facebook? or twitter? Give them to the ignoble mass and the results are bad.

[Dand]

This is why we don't win anymore. Take a good look at this shit right here. American education is a fucking joke. Look at it! Brazil is even laughing at us.

It's not a joke for students in STEM fields, at least in my experience. Those are much more like what Paulo said and don't seem to be infiltrated by marxists.

In college I took a film class (as an interesting elective) and the professor turned out to be on a list like this one because he was a leftist. I wasn't surprised to learn he was but in the class he was professional and knowledgeable about his subject. It's definitely possible for people to have radical ideologies but still manage to teach a class effectively.

This list is presenting information and providing sources for it. I don't think it is McCarthyism at all (that Prop Or Not website from last week accusing all non-establishment media of being Russian shills was real McCarthyism) and just gives more information to students when choosing their classes. I used Rate My Professor and asked students who had taken a professor's class what they thought of it before scheduling because I don't want to waste my time with a crappy class. As long as the information in this list is accurate it just lets students make more informed choices.

"As long as the information in this list is accurate it just lets students make more informed choices."

Isn't that the same argument to fill hell with people with good intensions? I cannot see how this will not be used to a witch hunt, it's just a fact.

I will never agree to give students or parents any tool to persecute teachers, even with the kindest intentions. It's just my firm believe. The task of a teacher is so hard that you cannot do that. Have you seen a tool called facebook? or twitter? Give them to the ignoble mass and the results are bad.

What's the connection between information and good intentions?

I have never seen this list before it was posted here and I'm sure it is not having a big impact on college students. This website is in no way an authority (they're doing journalism) and from what I looked at it is posting links to other sites with quotes from the profs. I don't think that providing students with more information will inevitably lead to witch hunts. I don't accept that to be a fact.

I am not ready to believe that we should hide information about professors from students for their own good. A minority of students will even care enough to seek this information and if those that do decide that they don't want to hear opinions from a marxist then that is their personal choice. Who could decide what is "too much" information for the ignoble masses? That censorship is too much power to give to any person or group and we might as well allow the information exist openly so that students (who are paying the professors for these classes) can make more informed decisions.

[Okeefenokee]

"As long as the information in this list is accurate it just lets students make more informed choices."

Isn't that the same argument to fill hell with people with good intensions? I cannot see how this will not be used to a witch hunt, it's just a fact.

I will never agree to give students or parents any tool to persecute teachers, even with the kindest intentions. It's just my firm believe. The task of a teacher is so hard that you cannot do that. Have you seen a tool called facebook? or twitter? Give them to the ignoble mass and the results are bad.

Thankfully we don't live in Brazil, and here we call that tool a right.

[Paulo]

"As long as the information in this list is accurate it just lets students make more informed choices."

Isn't that the same argument to fill hell with people with good intensions? I cannot see how this will not be used to a witch hunt, it's just a fact.

I will never agree to give students or parents any tool to persecute teachers, even with the kindest intentions. It's just my firm believe. The task of a teacher is so hard that you cannot do that. Have you seen a tool called facebook? or twitter? Give them to the ignoble mass and the results are bad.

Thankfully we don't live in Brazil, and here we call that tool a right.

Ok, let's see what the results will be. I will be around.

[Okeefenokee]

We've endured the results of free speech and freedom of association for two and a half centuries. I think we'll survive this just fine.

[jbird4049]

With the possibility of being both pendantic, and very extremely hyperbolic, as a political science major, and, like many here, a history enthusiast, I've learned that one of the techniques used to either gain, or maintain, political power is to attack, or at least control, teachers. Political opposition usually starts, or coalesces, around the middle, and/or the educated intelligentsia like school teachers, lawyers, and priests. The pushback to such is not always the government directly, but to supporters who use lists like these as enemies lists to "deal" with them. They happens regardless of the ideologies, political systems, or economy systems, involved.

In increasing levels of awful, the following started with attacks on, and by, such. The Red Scares of the United States, the various unrests, revolutions, and civil wars in Mexico, Chile, Argentina, El Salvador, Honduras, and Nicaragua, Suharto's Indonesia, Hitler's Germany, the Soviet Union, and Mao's China. If you want truly evil, and insane, one could include the Rwandan Genocide, and Pol Pot's Cambodia.

These all started small with the likes of teachers, lawyers, and priests and went very bad. So, if you are a political science teacher, or student , some of this will be in you mind, or in class. Even if this list is very silly.