Europe, Boring Until it's Not

[SuburbanFarmer]

WTF is this even about?? Why is Erdogan sending ministers to campaign for him in Germany/Holland? The news articles make no sense at all...

I blame the crusades.

I don't even see how it's connected to Islam.. This makes no sense at all.

[Okeefenokee]

WTF is this even about?? Why is Erdogan sending ministers to campaign for him in Germany/Holland? The news articles make no sense at all...

I blame the crusades.

I don't even see how it's connected to Islam.. This makes no sense at all.

[TheReal_ND]

WTF is this even about?? Why is Erdogan sending ministers to campaign for him in Germany/Holland? The news articles make no sense at all...

I blame the crusades.

I don't even see how it's connected to Islam.. This makes no sense at all.

It's not exactly connected to Islam.

Turkroaches are allowed to vote in Turkey, wherever they reside. That's why Erdogan sent his ambassador to rally the Turkroaches. Some weeks ago however Turkish consulates were supposedly passing out pamphlets in support of the Erdogan election which would give him full power. The pamphlets read "Hilal or Cross. Which side to you choose?" So Islam is seen as the motivating factor here for Turkroaches and their vaunted Ottoman Empire 2.0 attempt.

[Speaker to Animals]

[SuburbanFarmer]

I blame the crusades.

I don't even see how it's connected to Islam.. This makes no sense at all.

It's not exactly connected to Islam.

Turkroaches are allowed to vote in Turkey, wherever they reside. That's why Erdogan sent his ambassador to rally the Turkroaches. Some weeks ago however Turkish consulates were supposedly passing out pamphlets in support of the Erdogan election which would give him full power. The pamphlets read "Hilal or Cross. Which side to you choose?" So Islam is seen as the motivating factor here for Turkroaches and their vaunted Ottoman Empire 2.0 attempt.

Ok, and apparently Belgium and Germany have laws against campaigning for a foreign election. Fair enough. I even get that some locals would get mad about the propaganda.

But arresting Turkeys foreign minister and sending in the army?? This is getting weird.

I could not give fewer shits if Turkey has a dictator or sharia law. Not my problem.

[TheReal_ND]

They have elections in three days. The sitting government is being closely contended by Geert Wilders a "Nazi racist bigot" nationalist with a small "n" that is anti-EU. It's possible this was staged for the sitting government's benefit. At the same time this is a double blind for Erdogan who could not lose however his campaign attempts played out in Holland. Either he gets to wave his cock around in Europe's face (a win,) or he gets to act like he's a victim being persecuted by, in his own words. "Nazis."

[BjornP]

Ok, and apparently Belgium and Germany have laws against campaigning for a foreign election. Fair enough. I even get that some locals would get mad about the propaganda.

But arresting Turkeys foreign minister and sending in the army?? This is getting weird.

I could not give fewer shits if Turkey has a dictator or sharia law. Not my problem.

The minister (for Family Affairs, not the foreign minister) was detained, not arrested, but not because she was campaigning for a foreign election - in this case the April referendum in Turkey that could give Erdogan even more power and allow him to remain in the president's seat for an even longer time. Expat Turks were given the right to vote by the Turkish parliament in 2014.

What Turks, including expats will be voting on in April:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/ ... his-powers

As for why she was detained:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world ... 24246.html

A statement added that while the Netherlands and Turkey could search for “an acceptable solution”, Ankara was not respecting the rules relating to public gatherings.

“Many Dutch people with a Turkish background are authorised to vote in the referendum over the Turkish constitution,” it said.

“The Dutch government does not have any opposition to gatherings in our country to inform them about it. But these gatherings are not allowed to contribute to tensions in our society and everyone who wants to hold a gathering is obliged to follow instructions of those in authority, so that public order and safety can be guaranteed.”

Can't find stories about anyone having sent in the military. Only the police. As for the row between Germany and Turkey... well, they did arrest a German journalist of Kurdish origin about a month ago who was reporting on the closure of media, and suppression of government-critical news, on the charges of "terroristic propaganda" and "call for sedition". In 2016, a German comedian was demanded arrested by Erdogan, who pointed to an old, obscure German law made it illegal to mock a foreign leader. The comedian was acquitted, though. Didn't help Erdogan's reputation among Germans.

It was the German chancellor that negotiated the deal with Erdogan, where he agreed to keep most of the refugees streaming out from neighbouring Syria (and elsewhere) within his country. If the deal breaks down, he could simply allow that million or so refugees living in Turkey's refugee camps to walk into Eastern Europe. That's the reason most European leaders were so quiet when Erdogan started purging public servants, judges and closing critical media companies.

I think Erdogan is regretting that deal and is now trying to start shit with several European countries, as a way to force the EU side to be the ones who break the deal, rather than him. That way he can get what he wants, and still come out looking like he's in the right and that he keeps his word.

As for Turkey not being your problem... Turkey is a NATO member. While it never mattered in the past, in post-Cold War times, there are rules within NATO that member states must be democracies and their citizens enjoy a certain amount of human rights. So, you might not want it to not be your problem, especially if you want out of NATO, but atm it is America's and all of NATO allies' problem wether we like it or not.

[de officiis]

...and there's this...

[TheReal_ND]

France let the Foreign Minister Mevlut Cavusoglu's plane to land in eastern city of Metz on Sunday where a rally is planned

"I thank France. France was not deceived by such games," Erdogan said.

https://au.news.yahoo.com/world/a/34624 ... ion/#page1

Franco-Turkish alliance when?

[SuburbanFarmer]

Ok, and apparently Belgium and Germany have laws against campaigning for a foreign election. Fair enough. I even get that some locals would get mad about the propaganda.

But arresting Turkeys foreign minister and sending in the army?? This is getting weird.

I could not give fewer shits if Turkey has a dictator or sharia law. Not my problem.

The minister (for Family Affairs, not the foreign minister) was detained, not arrested, but not because she was campaigning for a foreign election - in this case the April referendum in Turkey that could give Erdogan even more power and allow him to remain in the president's seat for an even longer time. Expat Turks were given the right to vote by the Turkish parliament in 2014.

What Turks, including expats will be voting on in April:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/ ... his-powers

As for why she was detained:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world ... 24246.html

A statement added that while the Netherlands and Turkey could search for “an acceptable solution”, Ankara was not respecting the rules relating to public gatherings.

“Many Dutch people with a Turkish background are authorised to vote in the referendum over the Turkish constitution,” it said.

“The Dutch government does not have any opposition to gatherings in our country to inform them about it. But these gatherings are not allowed to contribute to tensions in our society and everyone who wants to hold a gathering is obliged to follow instructions of those in authority, so that public order and safety can be guaranteed.”

Can't find stories about anyone having sent in the military. Only the police. As for the row between Germany and Turkey... well, they did arrest a German journalist of Kurdish origin about a month ago who was reporting on the closure of media, and suppression of government-critical news, on the charges of "terroristic propaganda" and "call for sedition". In 2016, a German comedian was demanded arrested by Erdogan, who pointed to an old, obscure German law made it illegal to mock a foreign leader. The comedian was acquitted, though. Didn't help Erdogan's reputation among Germans.

It was the German chancellor that negotiated the deal with Erdogan, where he agreed to keep most of the refugees streaming out from neighbouring Syria (and elsewhere) within his country. If the deal breaks down, he could simply allow that million or so refugees living in Turkey's refugee camps to walk into Eastern Europe. That's the reason most European leaders were so quiet when Erdogan started purging public servants, judges and closing critical media companies.

I think Erdogan is regretting that deal and is now trying to start shit with several European countries, as a way to force the EU side to be the ones who break the deal, rather than him. That way he can get what he wants, and still come out looking like he's in the right and that he keeps his word.

As for Turkey not being your problem... Turkey is a NATO member. While it never mattered in the past, in post-Cold War times, there are rules within NATO that member states must be democracies and their citizens enjoy a certain amount of human rights. So, you might not want it to not be your problem, especially if you want out of NATO, but atm it is America's and all of NATO allies' problem wether we like it or not.

Soooo Turkey gets kicked out of NATO? I'm still not seeing the issue here. It sounds like a lot of diplomatic tension which could give us an excuse to lower tensions with Russia. All good things to me.