Another School Shooting

[Hanarchy Montanarchy]

Mentally ill people are more prone to suicide and school shootings.

We try to medicate mentally ill people.

Conclusion: The medication is somehow responsible for the suicide and school shootings?

[Otern]

19th school shooting so far this year.
Liberty has a high price.

No. Most of these are not what we consider a mass/school shooting.

According to FBI statistics, the US has around 40 people dying on average every year due to mass shootings. 40 people would be a lot in a small country like mine. But not in a country with 350 000 000 people, and just as many guns.

If mass shootings are a reason to increase gun control, every single person who drinks, smokes, or drives, need to take a long hard look on themselves.

[clubgop]

What needs to happen is we need to go back to the day where creating the ability to maintain an erection wasn't a multi-billion dollar industry.

A What? First off getting and maintaining an erection has always been a big business. Second what the fuck do vasodialators have to do with SSRI's?

[Montegriffo]

Mentally ill people are more prone to suicide and school shootings.

We try to medicate mentally ill people.

Conclusion: The medication is somehow responsible for the suicide and school shootings?

What about all the other developed nations which prescribe medication for mental illness? Do they have the same rates of mass shootings or is something else the more important factor here?

[Montegriffo]

19th school shooting so far this year.
Liberty has a high price.

No. Most of these are not what we consider a mass/school shooting.

According to FBI statistics, the US has around 40 people dying on average every year due to mass shootings. 40 people would be a lot in a small country like mine. But not in a country with 350 000 000 people, and just as many guns.

If mass shootings are a reason to increase gun control, every single person who drinks, smokes, or drives, need to take a long hard look on themselves.

All those causes of death have government schemes to mitigate the problems and restrictive legislation to back it up. If you are arguing that they are the same or similar then why the reluctance to to impose restrictions on guns?
Car ownership requires a driver to be a certain age, have third party insurance, have a license and register their car on a national database and penalties for driving under the influence. Infractions can mean your right to drive is removed.
Are you suggesting car ownership should be a free for all with no restrictions because it would have no effect on death or injury rates?

[de officiis]

I think we as a society need to have a serious appraisal of our love affair with guns and gun violence. Passing laws isn't the answer. It's a cultural thing, and it needs to change.

[GloryofGreece]

Could be that the shooters are usually mentally ill hence why they are on meds. Not that the meds themselves are causing them to go mad and shoot people. Correlation without causation...

[Otern]

All those causes of death have government schemes to mitigate the problems and restrictive legislation to back it up. If you are arguing that they are the same or similar then why the reluctance to to impose restrictions on guns?
Car ownership requires a driver to be a certain age, have third party insurance, have a license and register their car on a national database and penalties for driving under the influence. Infractions can mean your right to drive is removed.
Are you suggesting car ownership should be a free for all with no restrictions because it would have no effect on death or injury rates?

But there are already restrictions on guns in the US. There's plenty of restrictions, more than on cars. Less restrictions than Norway and Britain, but that makes sense, since we don't have the same gun culture as they do.

There's restrictions on alcohol too, but there are less restrictions on alcohol than guns, when you weigh the restrictions to the societal cost. Way many more people die or otherwise get hurt by alcohol related incidents in the west than gun related incidents, but alcohol is culturally important in Norway, Britain and the US, which is why it's not going away in any of those three countries.

Since guns have a huge cultural value in the US, the societal costs of guns would need to be way higher than they already are, to make further restrictions viable.

And no, I'm not suggesting car ownership should be a free for all, and you know it. I'm not an anarchist. Hell, I'm not even a libertarian, or classical liberal.

All I'm saying is the restrictions imposed should mirror the values of said society. Americans value self determination, self defense and gun rights way harder than other western nations do, and it would therefore not make sense to impose stricter gun regulations, unless the casualties of their less stringent rules outweigh their cultural values.

40 people killed in mass shootings every year is simply not enough when you weigh it towards 350 000 000 guns, millions of gun owners, and a culture which values guns a lot.

For example; around 8500 alcohol related deaths in the UK in 2015. https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulation ... eredin2015

Is it a lot? Well, yeah, compared to none, it's a shitload. But you Brits value alcohol to such a regard that those are deemed acceptable. There are restrictions imposed, just like in the US. But you're still way less restricted than for example Norway. The restrictions mirror the cultural values.

You can talk about which restrictions should be imposed, but after every mass shooting, people start talking about banning certain types or firearms, or imposing draconian background checks, to combat something that kills 40 people a year in an absolute huge country. It just looks silly, when those same people wanting stricter gun control in a foreign country, would absolutely lose their shit if they could no longer buy wine or booze at a supermarket.

[Martin Hash]

Bravo Otern. Exactly right.

[BjornP]

The shooter was actually arrested? That's a nice change.