THE ERA OF TRUMP

[Speaker to Animals]

F A K E N E W S
A
K
E
N
E
W
S

[BjornP]

I'm still not sold on the "facts" because of the democrat campaign and all their absurdity in collusion with media outlets but I'm starting to come around to the fact that for whatever reason Putin is actually a big deal with neo-nationalists. I'm still trying to piece that "fact" together and I have to admit it looks like Russian influence.

Clinton thought to use a guilt-by-association tactic to attempt to discredit Trump, no doubt about that. ssu's mentioned it already, but Putin's not trying to influence Europe, or the US or anywhere else because of some ideological reasons or because he wants to be Hitler version 2. He's simply weakening his international competitors/rivals on both sides of the Atlantic, and trying to regain power and influence on the world stage at the US and Europe's expense. The best way to do that in Europe is to strengthen ties to both the nationalist AND far left Socialist groups (in Europe, the far left - meaning hardline Socialists and Communists) are just as anti-globalist, anti-EU, and anti-elite as the nationalists in Europe.

And just to forestall a certain kind of counter-argument: The: That's the same as the US/NATO has and would have done argument. (Not predicting you'll make it, nuke, just want to cover my bases.) Yup. So? If someone wants to turn it into a moralistic argument, or an argument about principles... any country that wants to be stronger will always try and weaken the currently stronger country. That sort of argument doesn't really matter in real life, though. If you own a succesfull business, and another less succesful business is playing dirty to undermine your business, it doesn't matter one squat that you played dirty at some point. That wouldn't make it "unfair".

[ssu]

Good article, I understand that Russia uses paid internet shills for propaganda. The United States does too; at the federal level (Old article but I'm sure that in 2016 we use shills and/or bots online http://www.nytimes.com/2002/02/19/world ... d=tw-share) and campaign level (http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2 ... ebook.html). Many services offer Twitter followers (bots or paid shills) for sale. Fake internet users are SOP in 2016 and I accept that Russia wanted Trump to win.

The US (and Russia) btw aren't the only ones. For example Israel uses dedicated internet participants to support the government policies and especially go after anti-Israeli (hence naturally anti-Semitic) opinions.

I've followed that Washington Post article since it was first published and it's as blatant propaganda as those Russian shills. WP ran a story about an anonymous group that compiled a blacklist without any evidence that those on the list are funded or controlled by Russia. Now they've had to correct or update the story multiple times and at least two of the sites from the list are suing The Washington Post. It's irresponsible reporting and is itself Fake News. Glen Greenwald's attack on the article.Persons that follow some professional trolls rarely tell their name out, because as the issue about trolls here... you likely understand. Yet articles without references to any names are dubious or simply bad journalism. Hence far better to look that there is some quantity of unrelated articles from separate places confirming a broad picture. And the reality is likely only possible to read from history books later, when the classified stuff opens.

I'll agree that Russia wanted Trump to win but I am not so afraid of Russia that I would want to vote against what I think was best for my country just to spite Russia. Do you see what I mean? An argument of "Russia wants Trump too" isn't convincing to Americans that want Trump.

You vote the candidate you want, of course. Trump is no Manchurian Candidate, nor a puppet. And neither are the long list of parties that Russia has been favorable to. As I've said, Russia's foreign policy of trying to destabilize a) The Trans-Atlantic Partnership and b) the EU, just has been given a wonderfull opportunity as people are indeed fed up with the way things are. The Soviet Union was far too ideological in it's operations, present Russia isn't.

[ssu]

Seriously: Thank you for that. A vastly more reasonable stance on the matter than: "Only anti-Trumpers believe that Russia tries to influence US politics and Americans, and I am for Trump, ergo Russia cannot possibly have tried or be trying to influence the US". There are way, way too many people today who feel absurdly threatened by (admitting to) certain facts, because they have convinced themselves that admitting to fact A means you must support person or ideology 1, or belong to group X or Y. Most people here recognized the stupidity and irrationality of guilt by association-thinking during the "all those who vote for Trump or Brexit are racists", and other smaller discussions over the years on the DCF.

The campaign posturing should end as the elections are over. The Trump administration will be leading the US government, which actually isn't going to change so much.

Far better to look at what will happen next. How will the US respond? What kind of pressure does the whole thing make on especially the Trump's national security team? As I've said again and again, I think the honeymoon with Putin will likely be short. Couple of years max.

[The Conservative]

Just curious, why do you think liberals like/promote sanctuary cities? Also, how do you do that?

The why is because that's just what liberals do. The how are things like failure to determine or ignoring immigrant status during processing, lax ID laws or just giving drivers licenses away to anyone in CA, refusing to do censuses that reflect immigrant legality and I think welfare is not subject to legal residence restrictions but that might be everywhere.

Where are these shelters? Where are these liberals hiding these huddled masses? I'm not kidding.

Houston, San Antonio, Austin, Dallas, all of CA and at least NYC and other east coast cities all do the things listed above or down right refuse to hand over illegal immigrants, when caught, to ICE.

Some cities in Mass are the same way. Cambridge being the one off top of my head.

[TheReal_ND]

Whatever the case, all the posturing Putin and certain generals were making wasn't over nothing. Clinton would have been bad for world peace. And I'm all about the future not being McCarthy's The Road.

[pineapplemike]

Is there a thread for Trump's cabinet picks? Surely the talking heads will be talking about this one tomorrow:

Trump Picks Exxon CEO Rex Tillerson As Secretary Of State

As NBC adds, Tillerson met Saturday with Trump at Trump Tower in New York, the president-elect's spokesperson confirmed. The selection of Tillerson comes after Trump and his transition team spent weeks searching for someone to fill the post of the top U.S. diplomat. Former Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney and former New York City Mayor Rudy Giuliani were reportedly in the running. Giuliani said Friday he had taken his name out of consideration.

The 64-year-old Texas oilman, whose friends describe as a staunch conservative, emerged as a Secretary of State contender only last week following a meeting with Trump, when it was speculated that he would consider the offer "due to his sense of patriotic duty and because he is set to retire from the company next year." Tillerson's appointment would introduce the potential for sticky conflicts of interest because of his financial stake in Exxon: he owns Exxon shares worth $151 million, according to recent securities filings.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-12-1 ... tary-state

[Penner]

Is there a thread for Trump's cabinet picks? Surely the talking heads will be talking about this one tomorrow:

Trump Picks Exxon CEO Rex Tillerson As Secretary Of State

As NBC adds, Tillerson met Saturday with Trump at Trump Tower in New York, the president-elect's spokesperson confirmed. The selection of Tillerson comes after Trump and his transition team spent weeks searching for someone to fill the post of the top U.S. diplomat. Former Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney and former New York City Mayor Rudy Giuliani were reportedly in the running. Giuliani said Friday he had taken his name out of consideration.

The 64-year-old Texas oilman, whose friends describe as a staunch conservative, emerged as a Secretary of State contender only last week following a meeting with Trump, when it was speculated that he would consider the offer "due to his sense of patriotic duty and because he is set to retire from the company next year." Tillerson's appointment would introduce the potential for sticky conflicts of interest because of his financial stake in Exxon: he owns Exxon shares worth $151 million, according to recent securities filings.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-12-1 ... tary-state

So much for draining the swamp.

[Ex-California]

Is there a thread for Trump's cabinet picks? Surely the talking heads will be talking about this one tomorrow:

Trump Picks Exxon CEO Rex Tillerson As Secretary Of State

As NBC adds, Tillerson met Saturday with Trump at Trump Tower in New York, the president-elect's spokesperson confirmed. The selection of Tillerson comes after Trump and his transition team spent weeks searching for someone to fill the post of the top U.S. diplomat. Former Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney and former New York City Mayor Rudy Giuliani were reportedly in the running. Giuliani said Friday he had taken his name out of consideration.

The 64-year-old Texas oilman, whose friends describe as a staunch conservative, emerged as a Secretary of State contender only last week following a meeting with Trump, when it was speculated that he would consider the offer "due to his sense of patriotic duty and because he is set to retire from the company next year." Tillerson's appointment would introduce the potential for sticky conflicts of interest because of his financial stake in Exxon: he owns Exxon shares worth $151 million, according to recent securities filings.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-12-1 ... tary-state

So much for draining the swamp.

My thoughts exactly.

I wonder why everyone is still hysterical about Trump. He's picking cabinet members from the same group of people Clinton would have

[Penner]

Is there a thread for Trump's cabinet picks? Surely the talking heads will be talking about this one tomorrow:

Trump Picks Exxon CEO Rex Tillerson As Secretary Of State


http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-12-1 ... tary-state

So much for draining the swamp.

My thoughts exactly.

I wonder why everyone is still hysterical about Trump. He's picking cabinet members from the same group of people Clinton would have

Actually, I feel like these choices are worse than what Clinton would've picked (and I wonder if the DNC would've force Clinton to appoint Sanders to a cabinet position as compensation for campaigning for her?)