THE ERA OF TRUMP

[C-Mag]

Tuckers Pissed..................... I am too.

[SuburbanFarmer]

Even the god emperor quails in the face of the mighty IC. Burn it.

[adwinistrator]

These are the people who's lies led to thirty five fucking thousand American casualties in Iraq.

Do all these people think we forgot about that?

Do they think we forgot their staunch opposition to the IC while Bush was president?

Do they think we didn't notice when they shut their fucking mouths about all of it when obama came in?

There are millions of veterans watching this right now. We didn't forget what happened.

There are soldiers in country right now who were not born when this started, and the people who lied to make it happen are being defended by democrats.

They that sow the wind, shall reap the whirlwind

I recommend you read my 2,500 word post on Iraq intel and the justification for war.

It was the Bush administration who's "lies led to thirty five fucking thousand American casualties in Iraq". It was George W. Bush, Dick Cheney, Donald Rumsfeld, Douglas Feith, Paul Wolfowitz, Condoleezza Rice, and George Tenet that cherry picked intelligence, changed the standard of evidence, and made the case for war.

The IC was not unanimous, the NIE conclusions were filled with dissenting footnotes which were ignored by the executive branch and under-reported by the media.

While Condoleezza Rice was stating that Iraq was developing a nuclear weapons program, her own intelligence agency, the Bureau of Intelligence and Research (INR), along with the Department of Energy had dissented on the majority opinion used to make these claims.

While Dick Cheney was on TV claiming there was a relationship between Iraq and Al-Qaeda, there were multiple CIA reports that dismissed that claim. There was no intelligence information that supported administration statements that Iraq would provide weapons of mass destruction to al-Qaeda.

Douglas Feith (DOD/OUSD(P)), in the Office of Special Plans (not IC), used cherry picked raw intel to produce the analysis that the Bush Administration ran with publicly. They used this analysis to challenge the CIA's dissent. This slide is from their analysis, which was shown to the CIA, Tenet, Rumsfeld, Cheney, and Bush.



The 2008 Senate Intelligence Committee report found that remarks by administration officials generally reflected the intelligence, but failed to convey “substantial disagreements that existed in the intelligence community.” In general, officials strongly suggested that WMD production was ongoing, reflecting “a higher degree of certainty than the intelligence judgments themselves.”

I share your outrage on how we were led to war against Iraq, but I think the Republican administration of George W. Bush is responsible. To claim that the IC "led us to war" is factually incorrect. The Bush administration created their own analysis to use for justification and ignored all the dissent from the IC in order to do so.

The IC does not make policy, and if the policy makers decide to lower the standard of evidence to 51%, then that administration is to blame.

[C-Mag]

I recommend you read my 2,500 word post on Iraq intel and the justification for war.

With all due respect that is cherry picking. If it was one case, we could debate that. But it's not. The IC's failures that still haunt us go all the way back to at least the Eisenhower admin and the 50's.

It was the IC who initiated the reinstallment of the Shah in Iran, the Golf of Tonkin, in the late 70s said the Shah of Iran would never be overthrown, came up with the plan to supply OBL in Afghanistan against the Russians, told us the Branch Davidians were a threat to our country and then murdered 70+ Americans, set up and killed Randy Weavers family, gave the Intel to Bomb an Aspirin factory in the Sudan, told us about Yellow Cake, said Qaddaffi was a threat to America (X2), supplied weapons and money to people that would become ISIS.

Nah, they have a long brutal history of being wrong...……………and it usually costs lives of Americans.

Why defend them?

[adwinistrator]

I recommend you read my 2,500 word post on Iraq intel and the justification for war.

With all due respect that is cherry picking. If it was one case, we could debate that. But it's not. The IC's failures that still haunt us go all the way back to at least the Eisenhower admin and the 50's.

It was the IC who initiated the reinstallment of the Shah in Iran, the Golf of Tonkin, in the late 70s said the Shah of Iran would never be overthrown, came up with the plan to supply OBL in Afghanistan against the Russians, told us the Branch Davidians were a threat to our country and then murdered 70+ Americans, set up and killed Randy Weavers family, gave the Intel to Bomb an Aspirin factory in the Sudan, told us about Yellow Cake, said Qaddaffi was a threat to America (X2), supplied weapons and money to people that would become ISIS.

Nah, they have a long brutal history of being wrong...……………and it usually costs lives of Americans.

Why defend them?

My post was in response to a statement about the IC and the Iraq War, not the entire history of US covert operations.

I'm not defending them, I'm trying to place the blame of those who made decisions based on their own flawed analysis.

I share your outrage on how we were led to war against Iraq, but I think the Republican administration of George W. Bush is responsible. To claim that the IC "led us to war" is factually incorrect. The Bush administration created their own analysis to use for justification and ignored all the dissent from the IC in order to do so.

[SuburbanFarmer]

I think it's pretty fair to say that both the IC and the administration failed miserably in that case. They're still incompetent beaurocrats, despite their insane levels of power.

[C-Mag]

I'm not defending them, I'm trying to place the blame of those who made decisions based on their own flawed analysis.

I share your outrage on how we were led to war against Iraq, but I think the Republican administration of George W. Bush is responsible. To claim that the IC "led us to war" is factually incorrect. The Bush administration created their own analysis to use for justification and ignored all the dissent from the IC in order to do so.

Fair enough.

IMO, this is the trick bag they've put us in, one side arguing with the other. When BJ Clinton is in power the GOP will be all over him for killing civilians, when W Bush is in power, the Dems will be all over him for killing Iraqi civilians.

But there's one constant here. It's the IC pulling the levers. We need to unite and bust them up.

[C-Mag]

I think it's pretty fair to say that both the IC and the administration failed miserably in that case. They're still incompetent beaurocrats, despite their insane levels of power.

Agreed.
But they get all Presidents to go along. Hell yesterday they beat down Trump and he recanted.

Not good for Liberty minded folks in this country. If they do that to a POTUS, what will they do to you ?

[ssu]

The IC's failures that still haunt us go all the way back to at least the Eisenhower admin and the 50's.

And the failures usually happen because they (the IC) have to be a "team player" for the administration, give intel that the politicians in charge want to hear. Best example is the Iraqi invasion.

Too bad that they now have problems to be the "team player" for Putin under agent Trumpov.

[C-Mag]

The IC's failures that still haunt us go all the way back to at least the Eisenhower admin and the 50's.

And the failures usually happen because they (the IC) have to be a "team player" for the administration, give intel that the politicians in charge want to hear. Best example is the Iraqi invasion.

Too bad that they now have problems to be the "team player" for Putin under agent Trumpov.

Where's your evidence to support that?

Cause I can point to hundreds of thousands of dollars going to the Clintons and 20% of American Uranium going to Russia as Clinton Collusion. I can also point to Robert Mueller the lead investigator of Trump being deeply involved in sending Uranium to Russia and setting free Russian Operatives we caught.

Remember



I can point to Comey being in bed with Browder who funneled Russian money to the Clintons.