Trump Pros Vs. Cons

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C-Mag
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Re: Trump Pros Vs. Cons

Post by C-Mag » Mon Nov 13, 2017 10:34 am

Kath wrote:
Hastur wrote: It's less funny this time, that is the biggest difference. The hatred is stronger, more vile.
It's hard to deny that he is behaving like a lunatic, at least from a diplomatic perspective.

He's acting like a fairly normal person, it's just not the typical political image and speech that we have been conditioned to expect. And yes, we have been conditioned.

As far as Diplomatic affect, we do not know yet. The style is definitely different. Its been 10 months and we are not in a new war yet, so lets keep that going. The bar shouldn't be that low, but we do have the last 16 years to look back on.
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The Conservative
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Re: Trump Pros Vs. Cons

Post by The Conservative » Mon Nov 13, 2017 10:35 am

Nukedog wrote:He's literally an incarnated Archangel, chosen by God to come down at this exact point in time to save humanity from Lucifer.
Lucifer was "God's" Right-hand angel till he was expelled from Heaven...
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Speaker to Animals
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Re: Trump Pros Vs. Cons

Post by Speaker to Animals » Mon Nov 13, 2017 10:36 am

Trump is left of Bill Clinton, for whatever that's worth. People losing their shit over Trump might want to consider the possibility that it's they who are the extremists.

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de officiis
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Re: Trump Pros Vs. Cons

Post by de officiis » Mon Nov 13, 2017 10:42 am

PartyOf5 wrote:
Martin Hash wrote: Destroyed ISIS.
This is one of those items you near almost nothing about, even though it's kind of a big deal.
Probably be more accurate to say that he finished what Obama started.
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Zero
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Re: Trump Pros Vs. Cons

Post by Zero » Mon Nov 13, 2017 11:02 am

Off the top of my head....

PROS:
Shaking the tree and making the establishment uneasy

Testing robustness of institutions

Some of the deregulation targets

Unnerving some of the snobs who always presume they are right

Mattis

CONS:
Manipulable

Temperament

Twitter diplomacy

Compulsive lying

Some cabinet picks (deVos, Pruitt)



In short, I prefer a scalpel to a wrecking ball.
Hontar: We must work in the world, your eminence. The world is thus.

Altamirano: No, Señor Hontar. Thus have we made the world... thus have I made it.

KerningChameleon
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Re: Trump Pros Vs. Cons

Post by KerningChameleon » Mon Nov 13, 2017 11:23 am

Martin Hash wrote:Cancelled TPP, renegotiating NAFTA
This one bears some clarification: he didn't cancel TPP, he just pulled the US out of it.

Turns out the TPP is carrying on anyway, just with Canadian and Japanese leadership rather than American:
One of Donald Trump’s first acts as president was quitting the Trans-Pacific Partnership, the nearly completed free-trade agreement between the U.S. and 11 other countries bordered by the Pacific Ocean.

It looked like the end. Barack Obama’s administration had been the driving force behind the negotiations, and U.S. ratification was necessary for the agreement to take effect. But to the surprise of many, the remaining 11 members of the TPP have so far stuck together even without U.S. participation. Unabashed free-traders stepped up to counter Trump’s protectionism: Japan, the world’s third-biggest economy, has assumed the leadership role. Canada, initially a reluctant member of the club, volunteered to host one of the first post-Trump meetings of the remaining TPP countries to work on a way forward — perhaps because research shows that Canadians will do better if they have preferential access that their American cousins lack. Smaller, poorer countries such as Vietnam and Malaysia wanted freer trade with the U.S. but agreed to consider improved access to countries such as Australia, Canada and Japan as a consolation prize for years of hard bargaining.

Ahead of this week’s Asia-Pacific Economic Cooperation summit in Vietnam, there was talk that the remaining TPP members would use the venue to make an official agreement to proceed. Trump is attending that meeting during a five-country, 11-day trip to Asia that began last Friday. It could turn out to be the rare international summit at which the American president is sidelined from the main event.
Also, turns out those lumber tariffs don't actually hurt when successive major hurricane damage drives up your country's demand for said lumber:
Unlike China and Mexico, with whom America has large trade deficits, Canada is a country with which the U.S. ran a trade surplus in goods and services in 2015 and 2016. Yet in April, the Commerce Department announced that it had decided to tag Canadian lumber with duties of as much as 24 percent in response to what it deemed unfair subsidies from Canada’s provincial governments, which control access to much of the country’s forests. (Earlier this month, Commerce lowered the penalty slightly in its final determination.)

The tariff was meant to assuage U.S. lumber mills, which say provinces charge too little for permission to cut trees on government land. But Trump has no control over nature. The hurricanes that devastated Houston, other parts of the South, and American islands in the Caribbean this summer created unexpected demand for building materials, pushing lumber prices up and offsetting whatever pain Canada’s forestry industry would have felt from Trump’s border tax. Shares of Canfor, a major Canadian lumber company, increased by more than 40 percent in the six months between the time the original duties were applied and early November. Compare that with the performance of the America’s biggest owner of sawmills: Shares of Weyerhaeuser, one of the companies that complained to Commerce about Canadian forestry policy, were only 4 percent higher over the same period.
He's done a good job of securing Smitty's and StCapp's investment portfolio, at least. He's also helped proved that rather the the US not needing the world anymore, it's actually the world that doesn't really need the US. So, helping tear down the American Hegemony, that's a pro in my book.
"Old World Blues.' It refers to those so obsessed with the past they can't see the present, much less the future, for what it is. They stare into the what-was...as the realities of their world continue on around them." -Fallout New Vegas

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Re: Trump Pros Vs. Cons

Post by Smitty-48 » Mon Nov 13, 2017 12:52 pm

KerningChameleon wrote:He's done a good job of securing Smitty's and StCapp's investment portfolio, at least.
Big Daddy Trump, President of Canada <toasts>

Nec Aspera Terrent

Smitty-48
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Re: Trump Pros Vs. Cons

Post by Smitty-48 » Mon Nov 13, 2017 1:03 pm

OABTW; Auston Matthews, President of Hockey.



God bless America. <toasts>
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Alexander PhiAlipson
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Re: Trump Pros Vs. Cons

Post by Alexander PhiAlipson » Mon Nov 13, 2017 1:28 pm

Zero wrote:Off the top of my head,... Here's a partial list of mostly
intangible reasons why I don't like Trump, followed by a jejune attempt at displaying erudition:]


PROS:
Shaking the tree and making the establishment uneasy

Testing robustness of institutions

Some of the deregulation targets

Unnerving some of the snobs who always presume they are right

Mattis

CONS:
Manipulable

Temperament

Twitter diplomacy

Compulsive lying

Some cabinet picks (deVos, Pruitt)



In short, I prefer a scalpel to a wrecking ball.
"She had yellow hair and she walked funny and she made a noise like... O my God, please don't kill me! "

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Zero
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Re: Trump Pros Vs. Cons

Post by Zero » Mon Nov 13, 2017 1:44 pm

A bullet list was what was asked for, so yes it’s a mix of tangible and intangible and is fairly shallow. Next time I’ll ask you for a rubric.

:lol:
Hontar: We must work in the world, your eminence. The world is thus.

Altamirano: No, Señor Hontar. Thus have we made the world... thus have I made it.