North Korea News

[SuburbanFarmer]

The problem with your analysis is that the Chinese themselves want Japan incinerated. The only things holding them back are American alliances with Japan and South Korea.

There's also Taiwan, and to a lesser extent a lot of SE Asia.

It seems to me that North Korea is just doing what China wants to do but without the direct blowback on China.

Then GTFO of there, and make them face the consequences of their actions.

What?

What part of North Korean ICBMs falling on CONUS do you not understand? Do you think these people won't actually do it??

Of course not, without the Chinese backing them. So rather than face a sucker punch from China later, we should force them to toe the line or back off, by simply leaving the peninsula.

[Speaker to Animals]

Then GTFO of there, and make them face the consequences of their actions.

What?

What part of North Korean ICBMs falling on CONUS do you not understand? Do you think these people won't actually do it??

Of course not, without the Chinese backing them. So rather than face a sucker punch from China later, we should force them to toe the line or back off, by simply leaving the peninsula.

Well, I think you are fucking ridiculously wrong about that. I would place the odds of them launching nuclear missiles at somebody rather high at this point, and the longer we sit around, the more likely they will have reached the point to launch those fusion bombs over CONUS to shut us all down with an EMP.

Once they have that capability, you better believe they are going to invade South Korea again. They will demand that we step aside lest they launch against CONUS, and people just like you will demand that we do it.

Once you appease people like that, they will just keep making demands. There's no end to this based on our current policy that doesn't include them launching against us.

[Smitty-48]

Well, now I'm going to ask you to justify our thousands of military bases across the globe.

No pork there? Nothing unnecessary? All needed to maintain 'free trade'?

Well, quite frankly, Americans maintain their lifestyles by exploiting a global trade paradigm which allows them to live well beyond the means which they could simply by being agrarian yeoman farmers and Americans do indeed enjoy that lifestyle, but it is heavily dependent on America ruling the waves in term of the strategic lines of communication worldwide, so most of the bases are there to defend this global network of commerce and resource exploitation, as you can't actually do it entirely by seapower alone, you don't have to wander off into the Central Highlands of Vietnam to spread democracy, but ruling the waves does require a network of support bases none the less.

[SuburbanFarmer]

What?

What part of North Korean ICBMs falling on CONUS do you not understand? Do you think these people won't actually do it??

Of course not, without the Chinese backing them. So rather than face a sucker punch from China later, we should force them to toe the line or back off, by simply leaving the peninsula.

Well, I think you are fucking ridiculously wrong about that. I would place the odds of them launching nuclear missiles at somebody rather high at this point, and the longer we sit around, the more likely they will have reached the point to launch those fusion bombs over CONUS to shut us all down with an EMP.

Once they have that capability, you better believe they are going to invade South Korea again. They will demand that we step aside lest they launch against CONUS, and people just like you will demand that we do it.

Once you appease people like that, they will just keep making demands. There's no end to this based on our current policy that doesn't include them launching against us.

Ok, so they're going to hesitate to invade because of a few thousand ground troops sitting on the border?

If that's going to happen, it happens regardless of our physical presence sitting in the DMZ. Frankly, we should withdraw completely, because nothing else matters beside the boomer subs. It's suicide to attack, and they know it, regardless of the rhetoric.

Also, it gives a clear casus belli, if they take the first shot.

[StCapps]

Why withdraw when you are likely going to get pulled back in? If you withdraw, you won't be as well positioned if you do get drawn back in. Wishful thinking isn't an adequate foreign policy, China and Russia aren't going to solve the problem for y'all just because the US bailed.

[Speaker to Animals]

It's the rest of our troops that are their problem. What we have on the peninsula wouldn't stop them at all. Nor are they deployed there to be anything more than a speed bump.

But if NK can prove they can shut us down with an EMP attack over CONUS, they probably will invade SK while demanding we get out of their way lest we want to go to a nuclear exchange.

NK has absolutely nothing to lose in an exchange except for their nuclear missiles, which I doubt are all that easy to get to, and if we wait a little longer, there will be lots of them scattered around. A government that will literally starve it's own people to death in order to get those kinds of weapons does not give a flying fuck if you incinerate 90% of the countryside. They really don't care.

[Speaker to Animals]

And I am telling you right now, the same demographic that is shitting all over the American flag at this point will lose their shit unless you accede to NK's demands. When the shoe drops, and Americans have to choose between war and withdrawal, guess what the progressives and all the professional victims are going to want..

The North Koreans are not strategically wrong to take this path. If I were them and committed to their goals, I would do the exact same thing. They aren't behaving irrationally either. They are actually pretty smart to have gotten this far.

[Speaker to Animals]

MAD only works when the other side has countervalue targets they give a shit about. You can't have MAD with North Korea. You have to learn to accept that fact. We all do before this gets even worse.

[Smitty-48]

Ok, so they're going to hesitate to invade because of a few thousand ground troops sitting on the border?

If that's going to happen, it happens regardless of our physical presence sitting in the DMZ. Frankly, we should withdraw completely, because nothing else matters beside the boomer subs. It's suicide to attack, and they know it, regardless of the rhetoric.

Also, it gives a clear casus belli, if they take the first shot.

I would say the vast majority of Americans don't want that war, they don't want a casus belli in the northwest Pacific, and since they get dragged into any theater conflict by default, it's not in their interests to incite instability by a power vacuum, hence your "pull back so we can have a casus belli" mantra seems to conflict with the national interest of stable containment rather than actual shooting war.

[Smitty-48]

In broad strokes, American power projection consists of two elements, one is "keep the gravy flowing", and the other is "keep a lid on things so they don't escalate to shooting wars", and for the most part, this has been an extremely sucessful policy for America over the last 70 years, so why Americans would want to mess with such an overwhelming success, is beyond me.

Seems like there's just a handful of malcontents in America who are looking to stir up discord in order to advance their personal agendas in a domestic political bunfight, by declaring the most successful foreign policy in the history of the world to be some sort of "disaster" when in fact nothing could be further from the truth, and, you know, fuck those guys, cause they're bad ju-ju, and totally useless to America other than for sowing discord for discords sake.