THE ERA OF TRUMP

[Speaker to Animals]

The problem is not the GDP. The problem is that a trade deficit is what creates an indebted nation. The trade surplus nations tend to run fiscal surpluses whereas the net importer is actually soaking up your currency. You spend money to purchase things. The seller who sold them to you had to purchase them from a distributor. The distributor purchased them from a manufacturer. The manufacturer is in another country. You are exporting your currency. Your currency is devalued over time because of this. Then when you combine this with the fact that a trade deficit is actually indicative of a debt/lender relationship, the situation gets that much worse -- hence why the Untied States continues to become more indebted to the PRC.

[Speaker to Animals]

And yet while acknowledging economics isn't a hard science you continue to rely on a college minor and nary a sensible economic idea articulated from your own mouth as some kind of immunity against my actual arguments

Appealing to your own authority where you've neither demonstrated any nor been certified as having any.
Impressive.

I don't have to appeal to my own authority to show you out as a fucking idiot.

You were just using macro and micro demand curves interchangeably, as if they have the same underlying mechanics (they do not). When one poster was talking about the impact of the lost jobs to macro demand, you started talking about it like it's a micro demand curve for a specific product. You obviously don't have any idea what the fuck you are talking about. You are over your head and you refuse to actually go read a textbook instead of these partisan propaganda books.

I don't know of any school of economics that disagrees about what exactly a macro demand curve is. That's not debatable. You just don't understand.

You see, DB, the macro demand curve is the key to understanding the magic of protectionism. It's worked everywhere--where people understand the special nature of the macro demand curve.

You just don't understand, you poor illiterate fool. Any citation or actual argument would just be redundant and a waste of your econ-minor interlocutor's precious time.

Oh look, Kathy Newman is back with some more straw man nonsense. Do tell us how all we need to do is accept the rightness of libertarian batshittery and all will be correct in the world again.

[Fife]

Also interested in hearing what school of economics has a different interpretation of tariffs.

Perhaps the ever well-reputed Austrian school?

What different "interpretation" do you think the Austrians have?

I'm really interested to see where the controversy exists among actual economists on this *extremely* mundane issue.

We're in Flat-Earther territory here.

Most economists agree on the micro part of economics. That tends to be the least controversial but also the "boring" area away from all of the spicy issues that excite the freshmen going into the major. Everyone wants to go into economics in order to solve issues of brain drains or deficits but the macro area is where you can pick 10 economists and get 12 opinions. At least that's how my professors always explained it.

Austrian school is the black sheep of the economics community and will always be the butt of the joke. They are basically the English major sitting at a table of STEM kids and having to deal with everyone mocking them. The Austrian school isn't a big fan of mathematically proving their ideas and so it is kind of impossible for most serious economists to really have an actual conversation about the ideas. They are kind of a call-back to the old Adam Smith way of economics which looked at the field as more of a philosophy rather than the modern approach which is trying to develop it into a hard science.

Free trade is the global warming of economics. 9/10 scientists agree but the 1/10 that don't get all the attention.

Thank you for that lucid explanation of why economics education is generally a tub of shit, Professor Krugman. I'm just thankful I didn't have to pay $250K to get that summary of your econ degree.

The point remains, however, that the entirety of the academy will tell us that protectionism is a scam.

:goteam: :drunk:

[Speaker to Animals]

Consider the situation if our currency were still valued in gold. The current trade deficit with China (it's actually an economic war we are badly losing) results in the steady depletion of our nation's gold reserves. That would certainly be a problem!

But we have a fiat system. We can just print more money, right?? We do. And what ends up happening is that our currency is devalued, and because a fiat currency is actually based on DEBT, we are exporting our sovereign debt to China now instead gold.

To make up for the trade deficit with China, we literally have to print more money, and that means the capital we send to China to pay for all this shit is synonymous with debt. Meanwhile, the fuckers are actually buying up our treasury instruments. They are playing us at both ends. It's warfare.

[Fife]

I don't have to appeal to my own authority to show you out as a fucking idiot.

You were just using macro and micro demand curves interchangeably, as if they have the same underlying mechanics (they do not). When one poster was talking about the impact of the lost jobs to macro demand, you started talking about it like it's a micro demand curve for a specific product. You obviously don't have any idea what the fuck you are talking about. You are over your head and you refuse to actually go read a textbook instead of these partisan propaganda books.

I don't know of any school of economics that disagrees about what exactly a macro demand curve is. That's not debatable. You just don't understand.

You see, DB, the macro demand curve is the key to understanding the magic of protectionism. It's worked everywhere--where people understand the special nature of the macro demand curve.

You just don't understand, you poor illiterate fool. Any citation or actual argument would just be redundant and a waste of your econ-minor interlocutor's precious time.

Oh look, Kathy Newman is back with some more straw man nonsense. Do tell us how all we need to do is accept the rightness of libertarian batshittery and all will be correct in the world again.

LOL! "Strawman." Do you realize that everytime you use that bullshit you become a more hardened GCF moron? C'mon man.

I get the "libertarian" ad hominem shit you shovel every day; it's mildly amusing. I'll have to work on Kathy Newman for a while though.

[Speaker to Animals]

You see, DB, the macro demand curve is the key to understanding the magic of protectionism. It's worked everywhere--where people understand the special nature of the macro demand curve.

You just don't understand, you poor illiterate fool. Any citation or actual argument would just be redundant and a waste of your econ-minor interlocutor's precious time.

Oh look, Kathy Newman is back with some more straw man nonsense. Do tell us how all we need to do is accept the rightness of libertarian batshittery and all will be correct in the world again.

LOL! "Strawman." Do you realize that everytime you use that bullshit you become a more hardened GCF moron? C'mon man.

I get the "libertarian" ad hominem shit you shovel every day; it's mildly amusing. I'll have to work on Kathy Newman for a while though.

It's a fallacy that you just engaged in. Are we supposed to just nod our heads and pretend like this particular fallacy doesn't count??

[Heraclius]

Thank you for that lucid explanation of why economics education is generally a tub of shit, Professor Krugman. I'm just thankful I didn't have to pay $250K to get that summary of your econ degree.

The point remains, however, that the entirety of the academy will tell us that protectionism is a scam.

:goteam: :drunk:

We're about as poisonous to the economy as lawyers, but at least we can start ruining things 3 years earlier.

[Heraclius]

Consider the situation if our currency were still valued in gold. The current trade deficit with China (it's actually an economic war we are badly losing) results in the steady depletion of our nation's gold reserves. That would certainly be a problem!

But we have a fiat system. We can just print more money, right?? We do. And what ends up happening is that our currency is devalued, and because a fiat currency is actually based on DEBT, we are exporting our sovereign debt to China now instead gold.

To make up for the trade deficit with China, we literally have to print more money, and that means the capital we send to China to pay for all this shit is synonymous with debt. Meanwhile, the fuckers are actually buying up our treasury instruments. They are playing us at both ends. It's warfare.

Your ideas of national economic policy seem to be based on mercantilism. There's like 300 years of economics you were supposed to catch up on.

[Speaker to Animals]

Consider the situation if our currency were still valued in gold. The current trade deficit with China (it's actually an economic war we are badly losing) results in the steady depletion of our nation's gold reserves. That would certainly be a problem!

But we have a fiat system. We can just print more money, right?? We do. And what ends up happening is that our currency is devalued, and because a fiat currency is actually based on DEBT, we are exporting our sovereign debt to China now instead gold.

To make up for the trade deficit with China, we literally have to print more money, and that means the capital we send to China to pay for all this shit is synonymous with debt. Meanwhile, the fuckers are actually buying up our treasury instruments. They are playing us at both ends. It's warfare.

Your ideas of national economic policy seem to be based on 18th century protectionism.

LOL, what?

Put a 9 between the 1 and the 8, append a 0, and drop the "th", and you might get the hint..

[Fife]

It's a fallacy that you just engaged in. Are we supposed to just nod our heads and pretend like this particular fallacy doesn't count??

It's not, but so what. It doesn't affect my entertainment in watching you and most of this board jabber out "stawwwwman" everytime you get your doors blown off. Keep on truckin'.