Economics: Minimum Wage, Who Gets Hurt?

[jediuser598]

Minimum wage jobs are actually in a large number of small businesses.

Mega corp jobs suck.

As such they generally offer better wage to compensate for all of the other soul sucking.

Its the local sandwich shop that pays less than subway.
Its the local retailer that pays box boys min, not Walmart.

Course min wage where I live is $11

Raising the minimum wage never sticks it to the mega corps like many voters imagine.

McDonalds doesn't pay much above min.

Wal-mart has been paying near min until only recently. If I recall from my previous 2 years working there, I made about 50 cents above min?

So near minimum wage.

[jediuser598]

If you make minimum wage $11.50 will the price of milk be higher than if minimum wage was $8.25?

You should see someone about your milk obsession.

It's simple logic Kath. One I can prove over and over again for anyone willing to put forth the argument that "because minimum wage goes up, the price of everything else goes up." Same thing I do when people say something like "Why are you against Trump? Why not just give him a chance?"

Torture, Gun Rights, and "take out their families."

The truth doesn't have to be fresh, the truth doesn't have to be entertaining. I use the same talking points because they're what I can prove. Are you saying I'm wrong, or that my arguments are boring?

[SuburbanFarmer]

The argument for 'not passing along the costs' would be the insane levels of corporate mass-produced profitability that our industries now enjoy. Profitability has gone parabolic, and wages have not moved (adjusted for inflation).

This is also very simple. Getting pedantic about milk vs. soda pricing is completely missing the point. You won't suddenly see a 3x jump in prices on your weekly grocery trip. You'll simply look back 10 years from now and realize that you're making more dollars, but you're more broke than ever. Frogs and boiling water.

Also, regarding the wages vs. value argument - I find it amusing that we're willing to delegate determining the value of our labor to middle management in any employer's office. American values indeed.

The ol’ socialist “business owners are hoarding wealth and exploiting everyone” theory of economics that turned Cuba, Cambodia, and the USSR into economic utopias.
Good to see it making a comeback.


If business profits are “parabolic” and labor is severely under compensated, why aren’t you running a business GCF? You hate parabolic gains?

Lack of access to capital, as I don't belong to the ruling class, and have to finish paying for my employee transportation device and worker-training documentation.

I would rather work for myself than anyone else.

[SuburbanFarmer]

Also, regarding the wages vs. value argument - I find it amusing that we're willing to delegate determining the value of our labor to middle management in any employer's office. American values indeed.

Yeah that struck me too. Ended up in my sig.

Middle management doesn’t determine the value of your labor ... wow. Can people really be this far behind the bell curve?

Management decides the rate they will pay for a particular labor to be performed, YOU decide if that offer is worth your time. If you take the job, and the pay, where do you get off blaming management for hiring you? If Neil DeGrasse Tyson accepts a job bagging groceries for $8 an hour how has middle management screwed him? He’s screwed himself by bagging groceries instead of working as a scientist. For NdT to rage about management setting his labor value would be ridiculous.

And ridiculous is the word that describes pretty much all the content in GCFs post.

Do you think that your pay request was fielded in the C-suite, with the corporate officers carefully poring over your request?

Middle-management looks at their budget, then looks at his bonus, then looks at you and says "fuck off".

[jediuser598]

There is a lot of money to be made in starting your own business. Sure it's not easy, but people spend money on the stupidest shit, running themselves pay check to pay check when they don't even have to. People buy so much stuff. I'm pretty constantly amazed at just how much people spend on a daily basis, even when they don't have it to spend.

[DBTrek]

Do you think that your pay request was fielded in the C-suite, with the corporate officers carefully poring over your request?

Middle-management looks at their budget, then looks at his bonus, then looks at you and says "fuck off".

I think by learning marketable skills and following a directed career path my income has gone up 304% since I came to Seattle in 2004. And I think none of that had to do with middle management assigning me a value. It had everything to do with me taking my productive value to a management team that pays what I like for skills I can demonstrate.

Derp.

[SuburbanFarmer]

Do you think that your pay request was fielded in the C-suite, with the corporate officers carefully poring over your request?

Middle-management looks at their budget, then looks at his bonus, then looks at you and says "fuck off".

I think by learning marketable skills and following a directed career path my income has gone up 304% since I came to Seattle in 2004. And I think none of that had to do with middle management assigning me a value,l. It had everything to do with me taking my productive value to a management team that pays what I like for skills I can demonstrate.

Derp.

Me too. Job-hopping is the new 'career ladder'. Haven't stuck around more than 2 years in a long, long time.

That's not the same as 'asking for a raise' though, is it?

[PartyOf5]

It's relevant because if minimum wage was the sole factor determining price,

Who is even making that argument? We all know that wages are not the sole factor in determining price. It is one of the factors. Most of us also know that if you dramatically increase any of the factors that make up price, then the price will go up.

Your milk argument is a misdirection. If you give fast food workers a raise from $8/hr to $15/hr it won't affect the cost of your milk at the grocery store. What it will do is affect the cost of the items sold by those fast food businesses and the number of jobs at those businesses. If you buy milk from those fast food businesses, then yes the price of your milk will go up.

If you make minimum wage $11.50 will the price of milk be higher than if minimum wage was $8.25?

Answer DBs question posed to you on page 1 first.

[K@th]

Today is my 18th anniversary at my current job. My salary has more than doubled since I started. I could make more somewhere else, but I gotta lot of perks - a mountain of vacation time being one.

[DBTrek]

Me too. Job-hopping is the new 'career ladder'. Haven't stuck around more than 2 years in a long, long time.

That's not the same as 'asking for a raise' though, is it?

If you feel undervalued you should ask. Point in case, I just asked my employer for a 13% pay raise this month, with the understanding that if it’s not met my resume is back in circulation and my time on this contract limited at best.

Maybe they’ll fire me (they didn’t).
Maybe they’ll negotiate (they are).

But guess what, if my productivity wasn’t worth what they were paying me, or if it was equal to what they were paying me, they’d simply say “no”.

That’s what things look like outside of the unskilled labor pool, dude. You know your worth, you haggle your worth, you take the best deal you can get. If no one will pay you what you think you’re worth guess what ... you’re not worth that. Go beef up those skills and try again.
/shrug