Republicans Will Lose Senate

User avatar
SuburbanFarmer
Posts: 25278
Joined: Wed Nov 30, 2016 6:50 am
Location: Ohio

Re: Republicans Will Lose Senate

Post by SuburbanFarmer » Fri Dec 04, 2020 6:56 pm

Finally, another sensible voice.
SJWs are a natural consequence of corporatism.

Formerly GrumpyCatFace

https://youtu.be/CYbT8-rSqo0

User avatar
Martin Hash
Posts: 18718
Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2010 2:02 pm

Re: Republicans Will Lose Senate

Post by Martin Hash » Fri Dec 04, 2020 7:12 pm

TheOneX wrote:
Fri Dec 04, 2020 3:44 pm
The Conservative wrote:
Fri Dec 04, 2020 3:30 pm
You won't get it with the Democrats in power, they are the reason for the two party system, and now they are trying to make it into a one party...
That is why I have been entertaining ideas that would likely lead to greater 3rd party influence.

This why I've taken towards approval voting where you vote for every candidate you approve of. This results in no downside to voting for a third party candidate as you can also vote for an established candidate. Unlike ranked choice you can't just ignore the 3rd party votes that got knocked off in order to give someone 50+% of the vote.

Then I also think because there is no way to legally eliminate parties it is better to embrace them, and use a proportional representation in the House. So instead of breaking up a state into districts you instead have each party provide a list of candidates, then people vote based on party instead of candidates. So if a state had 10 representatives if 50% vote for party A the first 5 seats would go to the top 5 candidates from party A, then party B gets 40% of the vote so the next 4 seats go to the top 4 candidates from party B, finally party C gets 10% of the vote so the final seat goes to the top candidate from party C. I think this style of voting would eventually cause us to have more than just 3 parties with some amount of representation in Congress. That could eventually result in issues when electing the president, but I think that could be fixed with using a runoff system.
I assume you know you're describing a parliamentary system?
Shamedia, Shamdemic, Shamucation, Shamlection, Shamconomy & Shamate Change

User avatar
TheOneX
Posts: 1291
Joined: Wed Nov 30, 2016 3:16 pm

Re: Republicans Will Lose Senate

Post by TheOneX » Fri Dec 04, 2020 7:30 pm

Martin Hash wrote:
Fri Dec 04, 2020 7:12 pm
TheOneX wrote:
Fri Dec 04, 2020 3:44 pm
The Conservative wrote:
Fri Dec 04, 2020 3:30 pm
You won't get it with the Democrats in power, they are the reason for the two party system, and now they are trying to make it into a one party...
That is why I have been entertaining ideas that would likely lead to greater 3rd party influence.

This why I've taken towards approval voting where you vote for every candidate you approve of. This results in no downside to voting for a third party candidate as you can also vote for an established candidate. Unlike ranked choice you can't just ignore the 3rd party votes that got knocked off in order to give someone 50+% of the vote.

Then I also think because there is no way to legally eliminate parties it is better to embrace them, and use a proportional representation in the House. So instead of breaking up a state into districts you instead have each party provide a list of candidates, then people vote based on party instead of candidates. So if a state had 10 representatives if 50% vote for party A the first 5 seats would go to the top 5 candidates from party A, then party B gets 40% of the vote so the next 4 seats go to the top 4 candidates from party B, finally party C gets 10% of the vote so the final seat goes to the top candidate from party C. I think this style of voting would eventually cause us to have more than just 3 parties with some amount of representation in Congress. That could eventually result in issues when electing the president, but I think that could be fixed with using a runoff system.
I assume you know you're describing a parliamentary system?
The election system is not the defining feature of a parliamentary system.

User avatar
Martin Hash
Posts: 18718
Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2010 2:02 pm

Re: Republicans Will Lose Senate

Post by Martin Hash » Fri Dec 04, 2020 8:18 pm

TheOneX wrote:
Fri Dec 04, 2020 7:30 pm
Martin Hash wrote:
Fri Dec 04, 2020 7:12 pm
TheOneX wrote:
Fri Dec 04, 2020 3:44 pm


That is why I have been entertaining ideas that would likely lead to greater 3rd party influence.

This why I've taken towards approval voting where you vote for every candidate you approve of. This results in no downside to voting for a third party candidate as you can also vote for an established candidate. Unlike ranked choice you can't just ignore the 3rd party votes that got knocked off in order to give someone 50+% of the vote.

Then I also think because there is no way to legally eliminate parties it is better to embrace them, and use a proportional representation in the House. So instead of breaking up a state into districts you instead have each party provide a list of candidates, then people vote based on party instead of candidates. So if a state had 10 representatives if 50% vote for party A the first 5 seats would go to the top 5 candidates from party A, then party B gets 40% of the vote so the next 4 seats go to the top 4 candidates from party B, finally party C gets 10% of the vote so the final seat goes to the top candidate from party C. I think this style of voting would eventually cause us to have more than just 3 parties with some amount of representation in Congress. That could eventually result in issues when electing the president, but I think that could be fixed with using a runoff system.
I assume you know you're describing a parliamentary system?
The election system is not the defining feature of a parliamentary system.
How is, for example, Britain's MPs in the Lower House elected differently than how you're describing?
Shamedia, Shamdemic, Shamucation, Shamlection, Shamconomy & Shamate Change

User avatar
TheOneX
Posts: 1291
Joined: Wed Nov 30, 2016 3:16 pm

Re: Republicans Will Lose Senate

Post by TheOneX » Fri Dec 04, 2020 9:17 pm

Martin Hash wrote:
Fri Dec 04, 2020 8:18 pm
TheOneX wrote:
Fri Dec 04, 2020 7:30 pm
Martin Hash wrote:
Fri Dec 04, 2020 7:12 pm

I assume you know you're describing a parliamentary system?
The election system is not the defining feature of a parliamentary system.
How is, for example, Britain's MPs in the Lower House elected differently than how you're describing?
I'm just talking about how you elect your representative. I'll let Wikipedia describe the difference.
A parliamentary system or parliamentary democracy is a system of democratic governance of a state (or subordinate entity) where the executive derives its democratic legitimacy from its ability to command the confidence of the legislature, typically a parliament, and is also held accountable to that parliament. In a parliamentary system, the head of state is usually a person distinct from the head of government. This is in contrast to a presidential system, where the head of state often is also the head of government and, most importantly, where the executive does not derive its democratic legitimacy from the legislature.
Essentially, to turn us into a parliamentary system we would need to change how we elect our president from having the states elect the president to Congress electing the president.

User avatar
Martin Hash
Posts: 18718
Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2010 2:02 pm

Re: Republicans Will Lose Senate

Post by Martin Hash » Fri Dec 04, 2020 9:38 pm

So a parliament except an elected president rather than a prime minister.
Shamedia, Shamdemic, Shamucation, Shamlection, Shamconomy & Shamate Change

User avatar
TheOneX
Posts: 1291
Joined: Wed Nov 30, 2016 3:16 pm

Re: Republicans Will Lose Senate

Post by TheOneX » Fri Dec 04, 2020 9:50 pm

Martin Hash wrote:
Fri Dec 04, 2020 9:38 pm
So a parliament except an elected president rather than a prime minister.
At this point we are at a useless semantic. A parliament and a congress are the same thing. The system of election does not change what kind of government system you have.

User avatar
Martin Hash
Posts: 18718
Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2010 2:02 pm

Re: Republicans Will Lose Senate

Post by Martin Hash » Fri Dec 04, 2020 10:12 pm

You described how MPs are elected.
Shamedia, Shamdemic, Shamucation, Shamlection, Shamconomy & Shamate Change

User avatar
TheOneX
Posts: 1291
Joined: Wed Nov 30, 2016 3:16 pm

Re: Republicans Will Lose Senate

Post by TheOneX » Fri Dec 04, 2020 10:15 pm

Martin Hash wrote:
Fri Dec 04, 2020 10:12 pm
You described how MPs are elected.
Yes, I described a process that is used to elect MPs, that same process could be used to elect US representatives and senators. That does not suddenly change our system of government. It only changes our election system. This is very simple.

User avatar
Martin Hash
Posts: 18718
Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2010 2:02 pm

Re: Republicans Will Lose Senate

Post by Martin Hash » Fri Dec 04, 2020 10:23 pm

The U.S. has a less representative election process; a disadvantage of being first. I’ve done a couple podcasts on parliaments, I rather like them. They did get Brexit done after all.
Shamedia, Shamdemic, Shamucation, Shamlection, Shamconomy & Shamate Change