Daniel Shaver shooting

[DBTrek]

No.
They say he had been drinking, but if you watch the vid the cop specifically asks if anyone is drunk and Daniel says no, followed by the cop saying that everyone should be able to follow his instructions then.
/shrug

Seems like a “legal kill” though an avoidable one.
Why make perps perform all these antics when you have guys there with you that can simply cuff them while they’re face down?

On the other hand, how many times do you think you can jerk your arms quickly behind your back or dart them toward your waist band before getting shot?

[pineapplemike]

Probably didn't respond well to the officer screaming orders at the top of his lungs and threatening to kill him.

I would place the blame on both parties, he definitely didn't follow orders and kept concealing his hands which should be an obvious no-no, but I wonder if the situation could have been handled more reasonably with a more restrained officer calmly explaining what to do. The kid wasn't screaming back at the officer so I'm not sure why the officer was screaming at the kid. Obviously I only watched a few minutes of the encounter and it's impossible to analyze it properly, perhaps there is a reason the officers were so on edge.

Was is a rifle that had been called in, or a handgun? Doubt he could have been able to reach one arm behind his back and quickly unload on the officers with a rifle, I know it's a tense situation and it's hard to place blame but damn, that video was harsh

[Speaker to Animals]

About a year ago there was a challenge on YouTube where people had to follow the cop's I instructions. Most people failed.

[DBTrek]

Try looking at it this way - you’ve been called to a hotel where an unknown man has been pointing a gun out the hotel window. You have the guy face down in the hall but you have no idea if he’s armed or not. All you know is this guy stands accused of pointing a gun out the window.

How many times do you let him put his hands behind his back or to his waistband before you pull the trigger?

Once might be too many times.

Not condoning the actions of the cop who I think was rightfully fired for being a hothead and seemed a little too eager to kill. But I can see why the jury might hesitate to convict.

[Smitty-48]

Was is a rifle that had been called in, or a handgun? Doubt he could have been able to reach one arm behind his back and quickly unload on the officers with a rifle, I know it's a tense situation and it's hard to place blame but damn, that video was harsh

Yeah, but if somebody calls in "mad sniper in the bell tower", could be like the guy in Vegas, armed to the teeth, they don't know how many guns he has, and they're gonna be jacked up when that call comes over the radio. I would pretty jacked up myself, not a cowboy looking for an excuse to shoot somebody like this cop was, but still, you can't take anything for granted when you're walking into "mad sniper in the bell tower"

[pineapplemike]

^true, no arguments here

I agree completely @trek, but at the same time the kid was obviously rattled by the situation, he's on the verge of tears, shit he can barely crawl without falling over, you think he'd be able to accurately quick draw mcgraw before the officers unloaded on him?

Perhaps, but I'm not going to sit on my phone and try to pontificate.

I doubt I would convict but I'm glad he is being fired or reprimanded or whatever, I was not at all impressed with how he handled that situation.

[DBTrek]

Why is he crying?
Is he drunk?
Is he having a mental breakdown?
Is he high on bath salts?
Is he releasing emotional pressure cuz he’s about to cut loose a volley of hot lead on some cops in a tight hallway?

We have the advantage of hindsight.
Crying alone isn’t enough to signal “no danger here”.

[nmoore63]

I don't understand the crawling.

He was on the ground prone with hands out front. Leave him that way, and send in a guy to cuff him.

Either bad training or bad officer. Either is unacceptable for a professional.

[pineapplemike]

I think he was crying because the officer was screaming orders and threatening to kill him for shit like uncrossing his legs when he got up, but that was just my impression.

He could have been disappointed in the quality of the recent CS shows and was crying from lack of podcasts for all I know

[DBTrek]

I don't understand the crawling.

He was on the ground prone with hands out front. Leave him that way, and send in a guy to cuff him.

Either bad training or bad officer. Either is unacceptable for a professional.

Yeah, I don’t understand it either.
And the PD decided “bad officer” before the trial and fired his ass. Guy had “Your(sic) Fucked” etched on the butt of his rifle and conducted himself like a douchebagin previous incidents. The only real question was whether he was also going to do 25 in lockup.