Single Payer System = Death Panels.

[The Conservative]

People who don't want to suffer DEATH PANELS can continue to buy expensive private insurance because you're special.

If they could afford to, health insurance should not be expensive, nor should "state funded insurance" keep people from getting the possible care that is available to all.

[The Conservative]

I feel there are many problematic things about European style healthcare (for lack of a better term for it), but don't private insurance companies in America act in a similar way to the death panels by deciding if they will cover and what types of treatment they will pay for etc?

Yes, we could list drugs and surgeries they won't pay for, yearly caps, lifetime caps, and go on and on. The notion that our system is unlimited and unmediated is naïve. Every government and company makes decisions about what a life is worth, why do we think healthcare should not? We could have utterly safe cars but they would cost millions, remember when the automakers said seat belts and then airbags would cost too much? The were saying the lives saved weren't worth it. TC is basically agreeing with Stalin, one death is a tragedy but millions are just a statistic.

What I am saying is that health care should not be denied because of the insurance you have, state funded insurance as shown is a way to get yourself killed. "Normal" insurance is expensive because insurance can't cross state lines. So the cost of doing something in CA is more expensive than in TX, and almost any other state... Unify the insurance to be universal across borders, and you will have cheaper insurance.

What happened to these people though never should have happened, especially since it is not the place of the courts or any other entity (especially if a person has the money) to deny services, they would have otherwise rendered to someone who was rich and/or famous otherwise.

Oh and before people start saying I am calling for Single Payer Health Care, I'm not. I am calling about borderless health care.

[Martin Hash]

NHS, dude, Google it.

p.s. I was on NHS

[The Conservative]

NHS, dude, Google it.

p.s. I was on NHS

The National Health Service is the publicly funded national healthcare system for England and one of the four National Health Services of the United Kingdom. It is the largest and the oldest single-payer healthcare system in the world.

Fuck off. What did I say, I said borderless not single payer.

[Fife]

DEATH PANELS is a cynical hypocritic Talking Point.

What if it wasn't TC's OP, and someone else just said "rationing?"

As if healthcare isn't rationed now? Did you see the NYT article about thousands showing up for a popup free clinic in WV?

Accurate, but not responsive. The point being made is that "single-payer" involves absolute rationing by central command.

What you are being invited to do is consider a POV without rationing by the state.

[brewster]

health insurance should not be expensive

How did you arrive at that after saying there should be no gatekeeper of expenses (deathpanels). You do know that the overwhelming cost to our system is in the last months of life, often in the patient's 70's to 90's. This is often a choice forced on patients that would rather have a dignified death, "life panels" as it were. My relatively healthy octogenarian mother has made clear she doesn't want a protracted intervention when her time comes.

Fife, why does it matter so much who does the rationing, the state or the corporation? At least the state is theoretically responsible to you, the Corp not at all.

[Martin Hash]

I have a highly sophisticated pov. Medicare-For-All would end up with 60% of the population, and 40% who want special treatment will pay for it.

NHS does need small co-pays. People who get something for free exploit it.

[The Conservative]

health insurance should not be expensive

How did you arrive at that after saying there should be no gatekeeper of expenses (death panels). You do know that the overwhelming cost to our system is in the last months of life, often in the patient's 70's to 90's. This is often a choice forced on patients that would rather have a dignified death, "life panels" as it were. My relatively healthy octogenarian mother has made clear she doesn't want a protracted intervention when her time comes.

Fife, why does it matter so much who does the rationing, the state or the corporation? At least the state is theoretically responsible to you, the Corp not at all.

Let the person choose a dignified death, not have one forced upon them. My Papa was 92/93 years old by the time he died (he spent his birthday in the hospice and not by choice) He said to me as one of the last things he ever did, was that he stared at four walls and a ceiling all day waiting to die, he had congestive heart failure, which meant that he would ultimately drown in his own fluids.

He said if he had a choice he would gladly take a shot and end his life on his own terms instead of letting nature take it for him. A few months later he did die, by drowning, in a hospital bed.

In the case of the UK baby, there was no choice given, his parents were his guardians and they had their rights taken away by the courts.

So when I say health insurance should not be so expensive, it shouldn't be. There is no reason why things are so expensive in the first place. When you pay $100 for a pill that normally would cost you pennies on the dollar... or an increased price of several hundred percents because of reasons, I say fuck that.

Health insurance is inflated because of health care costs, which is inflated because they know the more they charge, it doesn't matter, they will be paid. There will be a time where that will not be the case, but that won't happen till the government gets out of the insurance business.

Want to resolve the cost issue, remove state borders, allow insurance to be sold across the country instead of one plan, one state. You want standard health insurance that would reduce in price, then make it so. Blue Cross & Blue Shield of the US, One plan, millions of people on it, the cost would go down significantly. Then you have only HMO plans, and on top of that you have Pilgrim Health or other insurances... all have to be national coverage.

There is your "single payer" system that is competitive through out the entire country... you pay in one state that is covered in all states... why is this so difficult to understand?

[Martin Hash]

Another dick who already has healthcare making arguments for people who don't.

[Okeefenokee]

Another dick who already has healthcare making arguments for people who don't.

don't treat anyone for any ailment you don't have as well, the post.