Women & Respect

[DrYouth]

Don't be sore StA...

I'm wasn't trying to be a snob.

Seriously, both those last vids were kinda crazy.

Two good looking people, both dead serious about what they are saying... they both seem pretty smart... but super intense.

That girl... she's going to make internet daters super neurotic...
"like am I being alpha now... or kinda beta... do I need to be more masculine and less needy?"
That being said... she's not wrong about a lot of her points.

[Speaker to Animals]

Seriously, both those last vids were kinda crazy.

That being said... she's not wrong about a lot of her points.

She's either "not wrong" or "crazy", but not both.

[DrYouth]

I'm going to go with "not wrong"... but she provides the information in a way that can make people crazy.
The transformation that she is proposing cannot be accomplished by her suggestions.
You cannot make yourself something by design, in order to acquire the thing what you desire (the girl in the video)...

[Speaker to Animals]

I'm going to go with "not wrong"... but she provides the information in a way that can make people crazy.
The transformation that she is proposing cannot be accomplished by her suggestions.
You cannot make yourself something by design, in order to acquire the thing what you desire (the girl in the video)...

Well, I agree that she was operating from a position of female privilege in which she assumes men must do whatever to please women. But I also think she was right about how women view most of these so-called beta males. I think she was right about the anger those males must feel at this point, having been become this walking rejection of masculinity, only to be rejected by the women who fashioned them into this sorry state in favor of men who ignored their demands.

From my perspective, these men should focus on developing their masculinity for themselves. Orient themselves towards other men for approval, if they even choose to seek external approval at all. Women should not be the motivating factor of a man.

I think the danger in taking her too seriously is that women by and large only care about themselves and each other. They don't really give a shit in the abstract if millions more men kill themselves because of what feminism has done to our society. One of the hardest truths I had to accept was that women are not and never were the more compassionate sex. That actually would be men.

[DrYouth]

From my perspective, these men should focus on developing their masculinity for themselves. Orient themselves towards other men for approval, if they even choose to seek external approval at all. Women should not be the motivating factor of a man.

I think the danger in taking her too seriously is that women by and large only care about themselves and each other. They don't really give a shit in the abstract if millions more men kill themselves because of what feminism has done to our society. One of the hardest truths I had to accept was that women are not and never were the more compassionate sex. That actually would be men.

See the problem is that we will always seek external approval...
We are designed to.
We evolved to survive as a collective... not as individuals.
We are not solitary mammals... we are not cats by evolutionary design.

Whether we seek approval from men as men or women as women... or across gender is somewhat irrelevant... we are in some ways doomed through human nature to constantly seek the other as a mirror unto the self.
The problem is when we rely too heavily on any one mirror... which we all do initially as children (our parents). If we are lucky we can find ourselves ultimately through a collective of mirrors, over the course of our development. Then we can become accurately secure within ourselves so as not rely on any one faulty mirror. Every mirror is ultimately inaccurate at least some of the time... but through a collective of reflections we can find the truth about our responsibility to others and to ourselves.

[Speaker to Animals]

From my perspective, these men should focus on developing their masculinity for themselves. Orient themselves towards other men for approval, if they even choose to seek external approval at all. Women should not be the motivating factor of a man.

I think the danger in taking her too seriously is that women by and large only care about themselves and each other. They don't really give a shit in the abstract if millions more men kill themselves because of what feminism has done to our society. One of the hardest truths I had to accept was that women are not and never were the more compassionate sex. That actually would be men.

See the problem is that we will always seek external approval...
We are designed to.
We evolved to survive as a collective... not as individuals.
We are not solitary mammals... we are not cats by evolutionary design.

Whether we seek approval from men as men or women as women... or across gender is somewhat irrelevant... we are in some ways doomed through human nature to constantly seek the other as a mirror unto the self.
The problem is when we rely too heavily on any one mirror... which we all do initially as children (our parents). If we are lucky we can find ourselves ultimately through a collective of mirrors, over the course of our development. Then we can become accurately secure within ourselves so as not rely on any one faulty mirror. Every mirror is ultimately inaccurate at least some of the time... but through a collective of reflections we can find the truth about our responsibility to others and to ourselves.

The way it's supposed to work is that your masculinity (in the social context) is conferred by other men. You achieve great things and other men acknowledge it. Men are supposed to be oriented towards approval from other men.

Our society went off the fucking rails when men started seeking all of that approval from women. Men gave women pretty much all the power over society and themselves when they did that. These betas are just men who seek female approval and were gullible enough to believe women's ludicrous demands of what they want in men.

If you think back over all the hilarious shit women collectively say they want in men, it all adds up to one thing: the modern beta male. He is like a woman with a penis. Yet women reject these poor men.

If you think about how our species originally evolved, we were a patrilocal species of bonded males. Women would migrate between the tribes (or gangs of men). What mattered for survival of the group was the fitness of the males who maintained and protected the group. Warfare was constant and nature was brutal. What mattered was whether a man could properly defend the tribe, bring home the meat in a hunt, build and maintain the structures in which everybody lives, and so on. Women evolved to be attracted to men who maximized their chances of survival.

It's only been about five thousand years of civilization as opposed to hundreds of thousands of years of living like I just described. Women are still wired for attraction to the guy who can defend them and bring home the most resources.

And one thing should be exceedingly clear about women: they have no idea how they even operate. I don't think women have the same capacity for self-reflection as us. They just don't see it by and large, and it takes a lot of work for them to see it. They are still out there in droves talking up how they want a sensitive man, a man who expresses his emotions, who is comfortable with his femininity. NO YOU DO NOT. Your string of outlaw boyfriends says different.

[SuburbanFarmer]

True fact.

[DrYouth]

The way it's supposed to work is that your masculinity (in the social context) is conferred by other men. You achieve great things and other men acknowledge it. Men are supposed to be oriented towards approval from other men.

Our society went off the fucking rails when men started seeking all of that approval from women. Men gave women pretty much all the power over society and themselves when they did that. These betas are just men who seek female approval and were gullible enough to believe women's ludicrous demands of what they want in men.

If you think back over all the hilarious shit women collectively say they want in men, it all adds up to one thing: the modern beta male. He is like a woman with a penis. Yet women reject these poor men.

If you think about how our species originally evolved, we were a patrilocal species of bonded males. Women would migrate between the tribes (or gangs of men). What mattered for survival of the group was the fitness of the males who maintained and protected the group. Warfare was constant and nature was brutal. What mattered was whether a man could properly defend the tribe, bring home the meat in a hunt, build and maintain the structures in which everybody lives, and so on. Women evolved to be attracted to men who maximized their chances of survival.

It's only been about five thousand years of civilization as opposed to hundreds of thousands of years of living like I just described. Women are still wired for attraction to the guy who can defend them and bring home the most resources.

And one thing should be exceedingly clear about women: they have no idea how they even operate. I don't think women have the same capacity for self-reflection as us. They just don't see it by and large, and it takes a lot of work for them to see it. They are still out there in droves talking up how they want a sensitive man, a man who expresses his emotions, who is comfortable with his femininity. NO YOU DO NOT. Your string of outlaw boyfriends says different.

Prior to the patrilocal tribe thing you refer to there was an even longer period of matrilocal clan (not tribe based evolution)...
Infants remained with mothers and aunts/grandmothers...

Men still competed with other males for dominance... that much is true. But women played important roles in mediating this conflict.

Tribes emerged out of clans as population density increased. This coincides with ancestor worship and agriculture/pastoralism... but most importantly higher density as humans filled every available niche. At that point females moved away to join the males family for purposes of defence/combat... and this coincided with increased family size.

Within gender relations are important and have suffered as you say. That being said across gender relations are also important...
At this time in our society you are quite right that we rely very heavily on across gender relations.... And they are not doing very well.
They are carrying too much of the burden. On this we are agreed.

And yes women do not really know what they want. I'm not entirely sure men do either... but that's another matter.

[Speaker to Animals]

The way it's supposed to work is that your masculinity (in the social context) is conferred by other men. You achieve great things and other men acknowledge it. Men are supposed to be oriented towards approval from other men.

Our society went off the fucking rails when men started seeking all of that approval from women. Men gave women pretty much all the power over society and themselves when they did that. These betas are just men who seek female approval and were gullible enough to believe women's ludicrous demands of what they want in men.

If you think back over all the hilarious shit women collectively say they want in men, it all adds up to one thing: the modern beta male. He is like a woman with a penis. Yet women reject these poor men.

If you think about how our species originally evolved, we were a patrilocal species of bonded males. Women would migrate between the tribes (or gangs of men). What mattered for survival of the group was the fitness of the males who maintained and protected the group. Warfare was constant and nature was brutal. What mattered was whether a man could properly defend the tribe, bring home the meat in a hunt, build and maintain the structures in which everybody lives, and so on. Women evolved to be attracted to men who maximized their chances of survival.

It's only been about five thousand years of civilization as opposed to hundreds of thousands of years of living like I just described. Women are still wired for attraction to the guy who can defend them and bring home the most resources.

And one thing should be exceedingly clear about women: they have no idea how they even operate. I don't think women have the same capacity for self-reflection as us. They just don't see it by and large, and it takes a lot of work for them to see it. They are still out there in droves talking up how they want a sensitive man, a man who expresses his emotions, who is comfortable with his femininity. NO YOU DO NOT. Your string of outlaw boyfriends says different.

Prior to the patrilocal tribe thing you refer to there was an even longer period of matrilocal clan (not tribe based evolution)...
Infants remained with mothers and aunts/grandmothers...

Men still competed with other males for dominance... that much is true. But women played important roles in mediating this conflict.

Tribes emerged out of clans as population density increased. This coincides with ancestor worship and agriculture/pastoralism... but most importantly higher density as humans filled every available niche. At that point females moved away to join the males family for purposes of defence/combat... and this coincided with increased family size.

Within gender relations are important and have suffered as you say. That being said across gender relations are also important...
At this time in our society you are quite right that we rely very heavily on across gender relations.... And they are not doing very well.
They are carrying too much of the burden. On this we are agreed.

And yes women do not really know what they want. I'm not entirely sure men do either... but that's another matter.

No, that's a bunch of nonsense. There was never a period of matrilocal anything in our species history. Maybe some human group somewhere in the past five thousand years or so tried it, but we evolved to be patrilocal.

What you seem to want to gloss over is the fact that we too are a product of evolution, and our behavior too is to a very great degree genetically determined.

That matriarchy bullshit is pseudoscience trumped up by feminists in the liberal arts departments. It's nonsense.

[DrYouth]

So no changes in gender relations in the change from clan to tribe in prehistory

Because StA says so.

Of course, all the research on this has been done in anthropology departments which as we all know are a hotbed of cultural marxism, so we better dismiss it all...

I'm sure StA has some evidence he can actually point to... for the evidence for patrilocality in our evolutionary past.

Pro tip: Matrilocal does not mean matrilineal... it also doesn't mean matriarchal.